IG Finds Missouri VA Did Not Taper Patient Off Opioids Safely

345

Taper Opioids

The VA inspector general confirmed allegations that clinicians at one VA located in Missouri were not tapering veterans off opioids safely.

This confirmation follows years of veterans lodging complaints against their primary care providers for removing veterans from opioids without utilizing appropriate tapering techniques. The result of these measures has allegedly forced veterans into the black market to seek alternative treatments for chronic pain including using heroin.

Here, the Missouri VA implicated is the John J. Pershing VA Medical Center located in Poplar Bluff, Missouri.

IG confirmed allegations of poor training and a lack of knowledge with at least one primary care provider who did not know how to convert opioid dosages to conform to basic tapering standards.

We found that a provider lacked knowledge of safe and effective methods for tapering patients’ opioids.

Despite a pain consultant advising on how to taper, the care provider was still unable to apparently add or subtract appropriately.

Where do you think they earned their medical degree?

Scared yet?

This news comes on the heels of another scandal wherein VA doctors, nurses and pharmacy staff are being investigated for skimming medications intended for veterans.

RELATED: Who Is Really Stealing Drugs Intended For Veterans?

Opioid Patient Tamper Issue

The IG report covered a variety of issues, but concerning tapering, IG made the following recommendation, which was allegedly complied with prior to the report being issued:

Recommendation 3. We recommended that the Facility Director ensure that the relevant providers receive education on the concurrent prescribing of dual short acting opioids and tapering of opioids.

Concur

Target date for completion: Completed

Facility response: The relevant providers have received education on dual short acting opioids and tapering of opioids. Safety Initiative Academic Detailing is being provided for all new providers during new provider orientation. Additionally, third quarter 2016,

Pharmacy provided in-services educating providers on the Centers for Disease Control’s (CDC’s) guidelines on prescribing opioids. The medical center also has planned tele involvement with another VISN 15 VA medical center in their Pain Summit, which occurs in spring 2017.

The Chief of Pharmacy Services provided repeat written education regarding prescribing dual short acting opioids in March 2017. Materials related to tapering of opioids, and information on consults that can be placed to assist, were also included.

Consults have been developed and made available for Opioid Taper Clinic Consults and Pain Management eConsults. These patients can be evaluated by a Pain Management Clinical Pharmacy Specialist who will assist the provider with the tapering process. There is also guidance available for tapering opioids in the Academic Detailing Pain Management Opioid Safety: A Quick Reference Guide which was given to all providers. An electronic link for the quick reference guide was also provided.

Additionally when an order is placed, during the Pharmacy review and verification process, the pharmacist monitors for dual short acting opioids. If it is identified that there are dual short action opioids ordered, the provider will be alerted, and clarification will be requested.

A review was completed of all non-oncology patients receiving long term opioid therapy.

Two patients were found with dual short acting opioids, for a compliance rate of 99.8 percent. The two patients who had dual short acting opioids were originally on one, with a new prescription written due to recent clinical changes: one patient was being treated for unilateral kidney stones and given a 30 day supply of an increased strength pain medication, and the other was given a 4 day supply due to increased “suspected cervical radiculopathy pain.” Both have instructions in the medication order “do not take Lortab while taking Percocet.”

I am certain all readers are thankful this idiot primary care provider was educated in how to add and subtract when figuring out how to taper a veteran off opioids, but it seems like too little too late for that oaf, no?

How frequently are other care providers failing to follow generally accepted standards, not asking for help, and then putting a veteran’s life at risk?

Source: https://www.va.gov/oig/pubs/VAOIG-16-01077-255.pdf

Sort by:   newest | oldest | most voted
James Clement
James Clement

Following.

Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve
Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve

When you don’t prosecute them for murder, they will continue to commit murder and I bet the FBI and IG gave them time to destroy the records/computer trail/paper trail, are you kidding me guess who is Baaaack…..

Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve
Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve

Med Malpractice after you have had the admission that dey jus didn’t study dat stuff in Medical training…………………………….

Warhorse
Warhorse

The so called opioid epidemic is as bad as the boy crying wolf. Many of us require this type of medication to properly perform our jobs. The problem is at the southern border. Has been, always will be. My time in Central America throughout the 80’s confirms that the problem then was as bad as it is now. Politics got involved in medicine, so now it’s an epidemic according to our elected leaders. I ask, how many of them have put their bodies through the torture that we have? Answer…… not that fucking many. Fuck your epidemic Washington. And as always, fuck you AFGE, fuck off VA.

cj
cj

.

cj
cj

|====|iiVA-drug-theft-programiiiiiii|>——–

cj
cj

Fuck you VA:
…………………./´¯/)
………………..,/¯../
………………./…./
…………./´¯/’…’/´¯¯`·¸
………./’/…/…./……./¨¯\
……..(‘(…´…´…. ¯~/’…’)
………\……………..’…../
……….”…\………. _.·´
…………\…………..(
…………..\………….\…

91Veteran
91Veteran

Ben, that poor training and lack of knowledge is a bullshit excuse when the VA is caught doing wrong.

The bigger question here is what the hell is that PCP doing stopping any kind of prescription if they are not educated on the medicine…including possible withdrawals?

If a PCP has an idea that a medicine can be addictive, wouldn’t that suggest withdrawals?

If they are as dumb as a friggin fence post, then maybe they should be flipping burgers instead of playing doctor with veterans.

They do the same with mental health meds.

Lack of knowledge? Really?

Angela
Angela

No, I believe their actions are all intentional. If they present their case as being dumb, then, they believe they will not be busted to the extent of being prosecuted in accordance with the law. They are playing the victim same as when the IG conducted their financial audits. If they present to the IG their lousy passwords or poor Accounting with VA funds, then, they believe that it is their way to escape accountability and the rule of law. When they want to be exact and very detailed with the purpose of harming or demeaning of veterans, they are very prompt and to the point. Their negligent doctoring is all intentional to get rid of Veterans. This is the bottom line. Socialism in it’s finest. Disgraceful.

T
T

I fully agree. And no-one by accident talks trash to veterans, threatens the group, tells us things like never to use the Choice card, never to use civilian emergency rooms or health care at all. Not even after a car crash, heart attack, to broken bones or hips. And much more. So that behavior is intentional, hate filled complete with the smiles coming from that punk with in 2015 bragged about being one of the VA’s best with 18 yrs of quality service under his belt. Yeah, I bet it’s under his belt.

While many other vets are treated and talked to completely differently. Yep, every bit of it, the crap, and then having it follow us into civilian life is all intentional and protected from the top down.

91Veteran
91Veteran

Angela, I certainly agree it’s intentional, and a claim of lack of training or poor knowledge is an easy excuse to avoid anyone getting in trouble.

How many years has it been well known that certain drugs are addictive? To claim a supposedly trained medical professional is not aware of the effects of cutting off that kind of medicine is just ludicrous.

If I were a veteran with medicine stopped like that and some bureaucrat asshat said my provider was unaware of the physical effects, then I would be going after someone’s license because they are utterly incompetent.

Angela
Angela

Benjamin, I hope you read my post. My further take on this is even with the legislation that is headed to the Senate “The Accountability Act ” soon to be put into law if confirmed is an uncertainty as to whether it will even help improve the situation within the VA. This is why I say this. Benjamin, the AFGE will be the blocking force like the Liberal judges are to Trump’s extreme vetting orders which are now headed to the Supreme Court. Benjamin, the AFGE has got to even be restricted with their use of power because they abuse their power. Benjamin, the CFR needs to be reformed to reflect new standards while eliminating many that do not apply. The 38 USC 511 needs to be modified, changed or eliminated but above all Benjamin, the Socialist healthcare system needs to be reformed into Capitalism which is the social system based on the principle of individual rights and based on the rule of law. Not rule of man. Reason why I say the Socialism needs to be reformed into Capitalism is not only to enforce the accountability but to create a system that is less regulated so one can breathe. Benjamin, I know the decent employees are few and far between in the VA but when they are mixed in with the bad seed or corrupt employees they do not even have the individual rights either to stand by and stand up for what is accountable, ethical, and humane with of course being in accordance with the law. Benjamin, the Socialism is destructive to both the veterans as well as the employees because it is not a system based on individual rights and rule of law. Socialism does not allow individual rights with anything about anything to include the employees standing up for what is right, for and of the veterans. Or even other decent employees. Benjamin, in Socialism, the system is not based on saving and improving lives. Socialism is based on a False Truth and Sabatoge. And too, Benjamin, I know you are an attorney and my comments that I have posted, you absolutely know the facts of what I am expressing. So my bottom line is I do not believe Secretary David Shulkin is really going to be able to do much because all entities involved with the VA are going to have to be reformed such as the AFGE, USC, CFR, and even the reform of the Bureaucratic Socialism to reflect more Capitalism. Benjamin, the whole system has got to be overhauled and it is going to take more than Secretary David Shulkin.

Angela
Angela

@Benjamin and all, there are signs of some efforts to implement changes that are starting to surface. Not sure about the seriousness of their efforts though. I received letters from the VA system in the Northeast to include the Boston VA system, West Haven, CT, Providence, RI, North Florida/South Georgia VA Medical Centers. Letters came from the VA Connecticut Healthcare System. The letters are about research that is oriented to the purpose of Discontinuing NSAIDs that are being used to treat Knee Osteoarthritis. Some of the non-steroidal anti inflammatory drugs include Ibuprofen, Naproxen (Aleve), Motrin, etc. These drugs are used for treating knee issues like pain, stiffness, or swelling. Anyway, it compares NSAID use with non-drug treatment targeted at managing pain. It may involve taking either a NSAID called Meloxicam or receiving phone based therapy to learn pain coping skills. Benjamin and all, the downside to this is just more research. This is all the VA does is research; and, it never results in any action taken that would lead to positive results for the veterans. Maybe they are trying to change the medications for the good of the veterans. Who knows? I do know the medications that they have listed do contribute to causing more health issues beyond the scope of just treating the knees.
For humane purposes, though, it really is in the best interest of anyone to not take these NSAIDs and too, look for alternative treatments that do not involve these heavy duty chemicals. These chemicals are more rough on the body than not based on what I have read on the FDA website and other sources. As for reducing pain and unless it is end of life pain, physical movement is always helpful which includes some walking if possible, swimming, stretching, yoga, zumba, light weights, light yard work, fishing, or anything that involves any type of physical movement. Movement actually helps reduce pain, helps get rid of pain, and speeds up the healing from surgery, injury or from any type of physical trauma to the body. As for mental pain, yes, minimal medications but intensive therapy is most of the time the solution to assist the individual in getting beyond the trauma or in getting beyond whatever has happened. Life threatening illnesses are a different story such as cancer but then one really can’t find alternatives to the hard cancer drugs. Folks though, many may not believe this but exercise or movement is even being used in conjunction with the chemo to treat cancer. This treatment approach is positive and is prolonging life. I am not sure if the VA is even doing this though because of their own perspective of ultimately harming veterans due to being the population control system that they are. I am not sure why they even sent me the letters because I do not have knee issues nor am I on NSAIDs. I am not the person of choice their research study. None of this applies to me at this time. The bottom line, though, is the VA does need to streamline their medication formulary to reflect more healthy medications, newer state of the art medications that reduce the side effects, and alternatives to the harsh medications. When newer medications that have reduced side effects are used, this treatment approach can enhance the functionality of the individual which ultimately could increase independence for the person. Also, as for alternatives —-avocado oils, castor oil, apple cider vinegar, tree tea oil, aspirin, tumeric powder, krill oil, fish oil, and the list goes on. Best. More insight to come relating to the topic of tapering off these hard ass drugs. Folks have a good day. Speak later.

figure8fan
figure8fan

Angela,
The VA prescribed me NSAIDs for several years at a high dose to try an lessen my pain. The result? I now have a very messed up GI track. I have tried almost every one of the non-narcotic pain meds for my knees. I have tried topical creams, cortisone injections, simvisc injections, therapies, anti-depressants, tricyclic depressants, anticonvulsants, lidocaine patches, acetaminophen, ibuprofen, anticonvulsants, and topical NSAIDs. This was done over the last 12 years. Some worked for a while, some had reactions, some did not help at all. The VA put me on narcotics and it does work.
I use them responsibly so I can work 50 hours a week and have somewhat of a life. I have a better quality of life right now. I know that the narcotics are not the answer. They are however, a larger part of the plan. Do as you have stated above, being active, helps greatly. I have always stated I will gladly give up the narcotics if something else can be found which helps. Until then, let me have a better life, a better quality of life with what I am taking now. If it does affect my liver, at least I had some better quality of life years versus taking away the one thing that is currently helping and making my life a living hell. I will take that trade off. I was a very active person and to sit and watch TV is something I really do not want to do. I have not asked for an increase in them and I would never do so.
f8f

T
T

Dang f8f, I thought you were writing down a large part of my history. With a few slight chances. No simvisc or other injections in the spine if that is what that is. Have had and need injections at times from both big toe joints, ankles, both knees, both hips., both wrist, both elbows, both shoulders. Nothing to be done for the neck but pain pills, collar, and traction here at ahome. Or the Gout but a med or Homeopathic treatment. Not much helps the Orth arthritis or Bursitis. Nothing to be done for torn rotator cuffs or torn muscles. Too old for any of that surgery repair I am told and that would probably not work or last well.

Tried all the rest and more and did nothing but about kill me and my liver. That is why more than one MD and a specialist I was told at the VA I “was very fortunate to get to see” was world renowned as the best. He was doing some free time at the VA liver clinic I guess, in from Europe I believe was said. Told to never do anything but narcs again for pain. To ‘never allow a MD to tell you how much pain you are in or to ever take NSAIDS (blah blah to keep it short) ever ever again in your life, never.” Unquote

I can’t remember the liver specialist name but he reported to me the opposite of what others said in the VA liver clinic. That my Non Alcoholic Fatty Liver Disease was significant, as did a couple of old civilian MDs. Stated that it will improve but to avoid allowing anything to raise my liver enzymes and such again. He is the one I wrote about before that when I went back to the liver clinic I was told to dismiss what he told me, and to just stop taking the mess of meds Neuro told me at midnight one time to stop immediately. Only later to be told by PCPs and other quacks to get back on everything from the beginning which would be totally insane. Neuro, before they went crazy and got yelled at and accused of things like taking dope in the clinic, or migraines was not a chronic pain issue any longer agreed with the liver specialist suggestions. Oh, I was caught by Daily taking a couple of Glucose tabs, hand to mouth with the container in my hands, and he still went off on me. Then calling me a liar about a colonoscopy. Amazing psycho shit over there. Anyhoo…

GI tract. Finally I was told by that clinic and others that I simply had ”slow, dry bowels”. Old age. I went for.. get this… one sold month here and there without having a movement. Some over there just thought that was funny as shit while I was miserable and like now, cannot get a colonoscopy because that poop stuff won’t work on me even when fasting time or the gallons of go juice is doubled or tripled, it no longer works on me.

They wouldn’t do other test but the X-rays and the, sonagram stuff I think it was. Just said smiling, no impaction yet, but full of poop.” Gave me Ducalax for the cure.

Occasionally I would taper down and quit all dope I was on then go back on starting with the various different meds to see what the effects were. Or if I was going to Jones from the narcs, which I never did.
The GI issues turned out to be from anti-depressants, anti-psych crap and their kickers they gave me like Ambilify and etc. I should have known this from my father and many others in nursing homes having the same severe issues and having to get cut on or have it dug out their butts and etc. Enemas all the time. But those didn’t help me with the upper GI being full. Older nurses at the homes used to be open about their patients being constantly constipated when given anti-depressants and tranquilizers to keep them dumbed down, calm, and docile brainless creatures.

The effects from that crap long term has caused me lasting issues and done something to the nerves down there that stimulates a move or when you feel the stool down yonder that I can’t feel down there anymore. I am really trying here but the words won’t come. And my arms are about shot for the day. the VA scum just won’t listen, knows best, and acted like I didn’t know what my body was doing. They’d say -shit- like ‘we never heard of that before,” or that oh no anti-depressants wont’ cause chronic constipation” etc. Lying filth.

I have a lot of shit stories for sitting around the camp-fire with the boys for a laugh.

Here is a real shocker for ya. What ever I am told by any quack does not work. I tell them what does and can easily prove it. I may not poop for weeks, belly swells, sharp pains, cramps, never an urge. I can take one Hydro 10 with the nasty 325 tylenol stuff and I am running to the bathroom in a half hour. If I take one and try to drive to Indy dealing with these issues I would mess my drawers in quick time if I can’t get pulled over and in a privy fast. But then we are all alike in every way according to the VA and modern medical socialist standards and trains of thought. That is like me accidentally finding out that oxygen helps my migraines but Neuro and others said I was not supposed to know about that and that the VA does not accept it as a treatment for migraines. Wow, I hate those people over there.

Codeine from a dentist for years will back me up but never Oxy or Hydro. So go figure. MDs never want to discuss — this shit— and less now due to stupid laws and socialist health care, and called ‘collective punishment’ to punish us all, or some of us. The socialist public as well now.

Gotta bust a move for the spine, shoulders, and knees, but that’s my story and I am sticking to it and can easily prove what I say. I will bet any freak of a MD or VA scum out there I can prove this and bet them all I have on it, and they must do the same, bank accounts included.

Any freaking doctors or pain clinics out there wanna try to make a liar out of me? I dare ya. Slap leather quick draws with bull shit medical knowledge. lol

Have a great evening folks.

figure8fan
figure8fan

T,
All of those were for my knees with the one exception of my right ankle. I shattered the Talus dome and got eight screws and a plate in it. I had very sharp electric shooting pains in it and did not know what it was. Told nerves were reconnecting and was given gabba for it. I also tried it for my knees with no luck.
Since the NSAIDs, I visit the restroom a minimum three times a day. Even with the Hydro, I have that problem. Most is the same as you said. Pain, bloating, gas, it is as if I am on a stimulant. Of course the VA PCP’s don’t believe that can happen if I am taking my Hydro “as prescribed”.
The Indy VA tried once to sedate me for a colonoscopy and could not put me out. I tried to tell them that the IV was not in my vein, but I have no idea what is going on. After they reached the max amount of med to knock me out, they gave up. If they would have listened to me and moved the IV, they could have proceeded. I hate to drink that stuff and for them to not listen to me and then tell me that I will have to come back and do this again, NO THANKS!! They are so stupid. They think they know everything yet they know so little. Now with my iron deficiency getting worse, they want to do another scope. I said HELL NO, if it is to be done it will be done outside the VA. They have not gotten back to me on that.
f8f

Angela
Angela

Further down the page with my comment about the VA Healthcare system from the Northeast sending me a letter, well, the Connecticut VA called me on the phone. I was on another call and chose not to answer. Also, though folks, I believe it is a scam of some sort. Reason being is they called me on a Saturday. I really do not even know if this letter or the phone call came from the VA. I did a reverse call and it linked the number to a doctor that is on the letter that was sent to me. I am still weary. Even if it could be the VA, why a VA that I do not even belong to? And too, I am not on any of these types of medications. So I do not get it. How can they even do any research at all on this type medical condition in regards to me when the condition does not apply to me? What is the deal? They put in their letter to pay me 75 dollars to participate. No, I do not think so. I am not participating as their guinea pig. Benjamin, do you have any knowledge about any of this going on anywhere in the VA system particularly if the veterans are not registered in the VISN that are contacting from?
Best.

Crazy elf
Crazy elf

“Where did they receive their medical licenses?” How did they pass a math class, (addition, subtraction, multiplication and division), for elementary school kids?
Let me take a fuckin guess! How about some “3rd world country” Seymore talked about a few days ago! Y’all know the ones. They’re the ones where the person pays a lot of money for a “Fake Medical Degree”. Then applies for an “H1B Visa” to come here and work for the VHA’s around our nation.
We are them every time we go to the VA. They’re the ones who speak little English, and can’t hold a civil conversation with anyone! They’re also the ones laughing all the way to the bank, with lots of taxpayers monies, to deposit! Because, they know they “…CAN’T BE FIRED…” when they fuck over a veteran. Or, GOD forbid they murder a veteran!

As far as the DEA doing anything. Here’s a new article out, 31 May 2017, y’all might be interested in.
It’s from:
“Judicial Watch”
“Corruption Chronicles”
Titled;
“DEA Blasted for Botching Operation, Lying to Cover-up Wrongdoing!”

Think about it. The DEA is supposed to capture criminals, not help them!
That’s why I don’t believe the DEA will be of much use in stopping the VA’s rampant drug running enterprise! Hell, they’re probably going to help the VA!
That’s my opinion!

cj
cj

@Crazy elf: elf, exactly right. The Veterans Administration, where tax payers money is used to pay the world. Sorry GI Joe/Jane, nothing left for you, so go be a good little soldier, and die under a rock. Your not welcome here.

Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve
Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve

Poor Training and Lack of knowledge is no excuse if you lead a platoon into an ambush because you lack knowledge and are poorly trained. The only thing is death, to you if you survive you will be killed by your own troops, and no one will have any evidence of it.

I have heard this poor training and lack of knowledge bullshit for years.

Jo3n
Jo3n

The last time I received an opiate from VA, I had to drive 180 miles, round trip. It was the ??? time they didn’t send them. While waiting an hour or so, for a script they said was on the shelf waiting. After the 6hour ordeal, I suffered a major heart attack. The following month, when they didn’t show, I called again. They, some clerk, told me I tested positive for thc. I hadn’t smoked pot for 3 years. They lie. Although my life style has suffered, I am not as frustrated waiting every month only to wait more, or the 180 miles. I will live without the pain meds, just not as well. Again, how can the VA be saved? There are liars, thieves, and worse at every level.

figure8fan
figure8fan

Prashanthi Bolla, a graduate of Mahadevappa Rampure Medical College, Gulbarga India, stopped my morphine WITHOUT tapering it. I was taking three tablets a day and had been for about two years. I had to deal with the withdraws, increased pain, and no one at the Roudebush VAMC cared one bit. How is this right? This is what made me become homeless. A previous PCP at the Indy VAMC did prescribe the pain med when i saw him but his accent was too great so I changed PCP’s. He was also from a college in India.
How many of these colleges’ in India have a ranking that is up to what the US requires. Of 501 medical colleges in the world, India has two ranked in that 501. One is 476 and the other is around 485 (I believe that is their ranking +/- a couple). How can these colleges that are ranked so badly be the ones the VA goes for? Easy, the VA can tell these so called doctors what and how they will do things.
I think the medical background of the colleges and what they instruct should be made available and there should be some standard that they should be up to.
f8f

Crazy elf
Crazy elf

“f8f”
Because the idiots coming out of those (low ranking) colleges are grateful to have a good paying job OUTSIDE of their “3rd world cesspool country!” Look at India. It’s a fuckin cesspool!!!!

Think about it. Wouldn’t you want to get the hell outta India, or any similar country, as soon as possible? I just wonder how many have a real medical degree?
I wonder how many reprobates are in VA from Venezuela! People down there have resorted to eating their pets. They must have run out of all the zoo animals!
Well, that’s what socialism does to a country!

Seymore Klearly
Seymore Klearly

f8f,

The number of fake degrees coming out of India is astronomical. Just last year their Cabinet Minister of Law and Justice Jitender Singh Tomar got popped for using two fake degrees to obtain his office. Anyone can buy a degree in any field over there. A lot of the people who buy the degrees are coming to the US.

With the Veterans administrations J1 wavier program for physicians they can come over here and start working at the VA without ever having learned anything about medicine and never having to complete a residence program due to the J1 Waiver.

Sources:

Wikipedia posting for Jitender Singh Tomar
“https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jitender_Singh_Tomar”

VHA HANDBOOK 5005.01 Transmittal Sheet February 28, 2011
REQUESTS TO PETITION THE UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF STATE FOR A WAIVER OF THE 2-YEAR HOME RESIDENCY REQUIREMENT ON BEHALF OF AN EXCHANGE VISITOR AND SUBSEQUENT EMPLOYMENT REQUIREMENTS
“https://www.va.gov/vhapublications/ViewPublication.asp?pub_ID=2383”

~
~
~
Can’t imagine why English is become a second language at the VA.

Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve
Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve

Hey Bro, we must run the non qualified scrubs out

T
T

Must be why some of them don’t know what low or high blood sugars are or other information that should be stuck in their heads for life, not so in Indiana. Had two and one older white American jesters ask me if 50 was too low of a blood sugar count. And foreigner over there tell me he didn’t believe in Hypoglycemia as an real issue. What do you, or can you calmly, rationally, say to these freaks? Nothing, so I just leave, especially when they say ‘we are here to help you, have you any questions.” Errr…well no.

T
T

Been gone from the VA since 2015 and I’ve got to say, that is about all I am running into in Terre Haute. Foreigners out the wazoo, MDs that won’t accept news patients, 4 minus one leaving as a pain clinic and that is being passed on to a yet another Paki or something.

The so-called PCP like others in this two hospital town that anything other than acute or worse is flown out to Indy to Eskinazi for care now. And they have been discussed out here before.

The MDs who are playing PCP will do the usual crap, blood test, run a check on ya, criminal records, pharmacy purchases, payment info, etc. Then send you out to others in the same clinic or out for say…feet, then another for shoulder, another for pain (the all day wait clinics), then another for other reasons. Each one saying well we cant’ give pain meds or do this treatment -just for one- part of the body. Well I say why not treat the whole darn body or consider the pain in all areas instead of piece mealing us out to many others just to spread the money around. Which also means each one wants to take their own X-rays and test. More money for that what are the dangers of multiple X-rays? I am told minimal. That is what some MDs on TV or writing books say it’s all about. Socialist styled health care and spreading their greed around, while making a lot of people suffer or die playing the pass around game or making the lose all they have for care or needed medications for life, or for quality of life. Plus the globalist de-population claims.

I wanted to save the stress on the limbs today for the garden but here is another heads-up. There are those foreigners claiming to be family practice or specialist. They must not be. I am told family practice or others specialist claims calls for them to take extra training, like with family practice I am told is 2 yrs or more internship and training. OR so I am informed. Internalist (for one example) I have tried for the guts and other issues turned me down merely because I seen a local pain clinic twice, then left telling them why, and they said they are internalist only and don’t deal with pain issues. Or veterans with pain. HUH? SAy What? But on their website may say…. “we do joint injections,” or some claim then their page only has one foreign med school listed minus any specialized training or other info. It’s a damn mess trying to get info figured out. We are being suckered, lied to, critically mis-informed, etc.,

The other mess is dealing with the way the VA sends out files with all the clinics and such jammed together in a pile it seems MD offices don’t like, won’t read, but complain about a huge stack of papers like a foot thick of nonsense and jumbled up jargon, heavily intertwined clinical, MD reports, and questionable info. Then to say to go back to the VA or seemingly dismiss plans to go through the files to get things done, which also fails. So far it’s still a no win situation against the powers that be. These medical boards to politician sure love having the power to destroy the quality of life, then laugh, or take constant vacations.

Not to forget the issue of not having a good ol’ fashion phone book to go by. No, we get crappy phone books with out dated info. Told to use the same on the net, make a ton of phone calls, and filter through all the false or misleading information about the clinic, MD, or what they practice or specialize in. The find a doctor call centers or through hospitals are a joke too. New foreigners in town, we are told to go there. Or told to go back and deal with the unpleasantness with past attempts for quality care and respect.

Ha, I got my feathers ruffled early when a guy called and said his MD, one who turned me down, sent him to Carmel and another far away town south east to pain clinics and injections. He drove hundreds of miles around the state to the appointments and was told ‘not today, we have to see you first then set up other appointments for shots and to see others elsewhere for their specialty.” and “we don’t have your files yet either, they didn’t send them.” The entire state is going bonkers and nuts.

Jesus help us. I gotta drink a pot of joe and get out in the breeze and garden. Have a good one folks, hopefully.

Horace Haberdashery
Horace Haberdashery

Welcome to new America,, woops spelt it wrong,,, had to ,, all medical fields are filled with outsource doctors if that is given the right name,,,, I won’t and never will be looked at by a outside help,,, Either his internship is America or its not,,, its pasted on the wall were he got his internship his education,,, I walk if its not or I can’t find his history on line,, period,,, These so called Jack asses,,, are using America way,, for there pleasure,, I did not protect them ,, but as always 80% of this so called America bow and go to them,,,,

figure8fan
figure8fan

So do we boycott any PCP who is not or has not done their internship in America? We have no choice in our PCP. We are assigned one. We should have a say if that person is dealing with our health and wellbeing. I will never have a PCP who has not done this. We can put in for a change of provider. Just a thought.
f8f

Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve
Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve

It is time for veterans to organize LEGALLY into fighting and training units, which are like the Military reserves to be able to respond to the organized thuggery, and which units are known to the feds and the local police. THAT IS WHAT THE 2ND AMENDMENT WAS CREATED FOR:

James Clement
James Clement

Does not matter what problems are uncovered at the VA, or with the AFGE. THERE WILL ALWAYS BE AN EXCUSE they will provide. PERIOD. THAT is why only 1/3 of the VA ANNUAL BUDGET goes to treating/compensating veterans for injuries/disabilities incurred as a result of their service.

The OTHER 2/3’s goes to PR Firms, Bonuses for doing such a stellar job of fucking over veterans, Training that is of pyss-poor quality and conducted by third-world providers, and contracting out in a very nepotistic-based system.

There is a very simple solution that solves ALL of those problems, saves the U.S. TAXPAYERS millions of dollars annually, and will over the first two years of implementation – – – improve the lives of America’s veterans significantly.

FIX THE DAMN BROKEN VA:

1. Recognize the problems inherent in the VA are SYSTEM-WIDE, not just limited to a few locations.

2. Fire all the Lazy No Good Workers. Fire EVERY single AFGE/SES Employee.

3. Sell off all the VA facilities. Alternatively, they may be converted into housing for homeless veterans.

4. Issue all veterans a card that allows them to choose their own doctors within their community that they can TRUST.

5. The United States Government will PAY those doctors promptly (Within 45 days) for the care they provide veterans.

6. ELIMINATE the “Federal Protection” Umbrella for incompetent QUACKS that the VA sends to other states to practice other than their own. Going to practice in Hawaii? You need to be LICENSED in Hawaii. Same applies to all other states.

7. Any claim a veteran submits that requires more than 90 days to adjudicate, is automatically found to be in favor of the veteran. If a claim filed by a veteran is found to be a false one designed to scam the system, the VA will have to prove in civil court that a false claim was intentionally submitted.

8. All veterans will be allowed to seek/retain the services of a Veterans Rights Attorney from their first initial contact with the VA.

9. No AFGE, nor any other Labor Union business will be allowed to take place in any Federal Workplace. Conducting Union Business during working hours will is prohibited, and will be strictly enforced. Should any government employee be found violating this provision, it will result in IMMEDIATE DISMISSAL. Attorney’s for appeal will be retained at the former employee’s PERSONAL expense. U. S. Taxpayer’s will not be subject to payment of legal bills for incompetent personnel with regards to Governmental Employment.

POTUS Reagan broke up PATCO in the ’80’s. POTUS Trump and our current Congress Critters do NOT have Veterans Interests at heart. Perhaps their replacements will. VOTE OUT all these WORTHLESS INCUMBENTS. Give their replacement’s one term to take care of the Veterans. If they cannot muster the stones to do it properly – – – vote their worthless asses out as well. Party should NOT MATTER. What SHOULD MATTER is their voting records on VETERANS ISSUES.

NO Combat Veteran should be surprised when the next McVeigh Incident occurs. Bound to happen. Just a matter of time . . .

Disgruntled Veteran
1973 – 1976 USMC
1978 – 1993 USN

namnibor
namnibor

Glad to see you added #9. 🙂

James Clement
James Clement

@Namnibor – – – Just continuing to develop my rant. Working on my petition for veterans to the White House. Part of my rant (SECRET NOFURDEM for now) will become part of that petition.

Appreciate your suggestion. I still need to fine tune #9 a bit – – – but thought I would throw it out here for your specific input today. After all, without your comment – – – it might never have occurred to me.

Thank You.

Disgruntled Veteran
1973 – 1976 USMC
1978 – 1993 USN

namnibor
namnibor

I think I may see the problem and it’s right in front of our faces in Benjamin’s “Bad VA Art” today.

That aluminum opiate painkiller blister pack looks deceivingly like a slice of cheese and the rats just love the shit.

RAND Corp. recommends the “Candyman Crush”.

cj
cj

@namnibor: LMAOOOOOOO, Excellent eye you have there. (Makes note, fax over BIG rat traps to namnibor)

cj
cj

Uses mini sledge in the meantime. “Here ratty ratty ratty” BAMMMM!!! <3()~~~

namnibor
namnibor

@cj- That mini sledge will not do in this case. The VA rats have been genetically merged with that of Opossums. Viciously vile creatures with pointy teeth and funny hats.
I’m thinking bear traps connected to 440V live wire with opiate blister packs for bait.

cj
cj

@namnibor: Correction, adds mini, nuclear generator/transformer, to care package. ~¥¥¥¥~ and defanger VvvvV—-> vvv

Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve
Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve

Well said, and if any survive, let’s take em down to a special prosecutor who will guide them into the federal prison hospital for quadraphlegics
I have seen the arrogance of the VA bureaucrats up close many times, we must not have any sympathy for these vultures any more than sympathy for a dog with rabies who has just bitten you child.

James Clement
James Clement

@Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve – – – While I would kill them both, I would find it somewhat harder to kill the dog with rabies . . .

The reason I try to stay away from the VA as much as possible is because I fear that one day I will truly SNAP while there. If I ever do SNAP at the VA . . . it would definitely make the news.

Better my plan of self-imposed hermitacy. Better for me. Better for them.

Disgruntled Veteran
1973 – 1976 USMC
1978 – 1993 USN

namnibor
namnibor

Let the dog with rabies gnaw on them for a bit then see if there’s any difference in their indifferent attitudes while infected with rabies. I guessing not much change from VA zombie rat to VA zombie rat with rabies. But we must try and the dog will be more than happy to help any way he can.

James Clement
James Clement

@Namnibor – – – Brilliant !!!

Jo3n
Jo3n

Until we can find these fools accountable, what’s the use ? I’m usually wrong, but, there are so many issues going on with our new Government, I can’t foresee any changes that will affect anyone making less than 40,000 a year. Other than getting poorer. We have a confused congress, and an ass kissing Senate. Just feel like we gonna get screwed…again. God Bless the Veterans.

Horace
Horace

HELL does any doctor understand tapering off any addictive drugs,,,, I READ THE ENTIRE RULES in my state to all of this not only the VA doesn’t but neither do the private sector obey any of it,,, though the private have more compassion,, and carring then the VA,,,, THIS HAPPEN,,, for me the end of the year came I was using several addictive drugs one was Hydrocoden,, and then cam Jan 1st no one told me no one warned me,, nothing they just didn’t send it,,, I was taking 6 a day but using as I needed,,, but none was sent and the battle began,,, but its not the only one its Antidepresents,,, Lorizapane,,, and others just very simple they stop sending them,,,, withdrawls they don’t care take an asperin sorry about the spelling but I don’t use the VA no longer,,,, 47 years is enough,,,, I have seen it all,,,,, and its worst today then it was before,,,,, steve

Dennis
Dennis

Good golly if we begin to require VA doctors to comply with American standards then the next thing you guys will want is a requirement that they be multi-lingual and speak English too! I tell you that when you get demanding like this that it has no end! The next thing you know patients will be calling on congress to cook the chicken awarded vets as compensation while enjoying the world class service from folks born around the world during eir time at VA. Rambo would eat the stuff and be grateful! Third world providers bring the kind of world class service to vets that is impossible to get elsewhere in America guys….what more do you want from America – A can of RAID???

namnibor
namnibor

BVA Murphy has all the RAID secured and is protecting the stockholders from the beneficiaries.

figure8fan
figure8fan

Dennis,
on that college’s website it states:
•Candidates should have passed 12th standard and should have obtained 50% aggregate marks in Physics, Chemistry and Biology (taken together) and should have passed English as one of the subjects.
•The candidates should have completed 17 years of age as on the 31st December of the year of admission.
Selection is through COMED-K and CET
They know where they are sending them. I bet the VA goes over and recruits them.
f8f

Jo3n
Jo3n

I really really really wish RAID would work. What do I expect? I don’t know any more. I’m just going day to day.

Crazy elf
Crazy elf

91Veteran and namnibor,
Earlier we discussed about how VA possibly continues keeping veterans on a prescription list, yet the vet is no longer receives it!

“91” you seemed to have remembered, possibly/maybe, a veteran being contacted, which alerted the investigator(s) concerning this very issue!

Now, Wouldn’t it be a hoot IF every veteran, or at least a large portion of the veterans’ population, were to be contacted – and the investigators were to learn VA employees were responsible for the diversion of LARGE quantities of drugs hitting the streets and being sent to other countries!
And the involvement was so emense that many of/in the media outlets just couldn’t resist putting the story out!

God, wouldn’t that just be magnificent!

In a “mood!”
Trying to combat some real pain in my legs, arms and torso tonight.

T
T

Odd. In Indiana both the VA and civilian quacks seems to have cut people off cold turkey for years now and the medical boards, politicians, media, those ‘inspectors’ don’t give a rat’s butt about anything going on here. I am far past the point of showing any form of respect to the scum in suits or long white coats with alphabets by their names or sitting in high offices wallowing in their money and power thinking their fancy titles or offices are akin to God while their perceived thoughts of us being ‘Domestic Terrorist” or as the Indy VA New Pain Clinic told our group were “Criminals or Will Be, All Are.” Then proceeded to tell us, order us, about all the other new rules and contracts to be signed and followed to the T. Like not using our phony Choice Cards to not using civilian emergency rooms for any thing but to drive to Indy even if in a car wreck to heart attacks, etc. If that isn’t intentional abuse, Draconian BS, tyranny, neglect, I don’t know what is. And the IG, governors, Attorney General, local vet groups and all the rest simply don’t give a damn. But rush to protect the regime and scum from top to bottom leaving us/me near totally censored, threatened, laughed at by city council members, and the rest. The cherry (a rotten one) on top is the fear people have to speak out or complain, or just settle for what others ”order’ them to do, or else.

Since Aug 2015 I have had only two scripts for pain and one I could not use, Tramadol. One pill and I thought I was going to die and laid in bed for two days with a rapid heart beat and etc. Later after leaving the VA to see a local uncaring PC sent me to a jam packed pain clinic, only four locally to take care of a county of around a hundred thousand, to sit for up to six hours for a months supply of simple Hydrocodone. Total BS. And that was last year and none since. I refuse to be disrespected that way and to be ‘forced’ to see doctors seemingly on speed and won’t let you get a full sentence out they squawking and moving around so much, plus having to sign pages of really insane contracts besides the usual required trash and waste of good trees.

So my mobility has gone down hill, can’t do much. Nothing for migraines, during the broken jaw from dental episode and having all those surgeries plus extracting bone chips for over two years our of my jaw. Put on a bunch of weight and the last liver specialist told my can’t take over the counter crap but to stay on narcs, period.

Called to get into a more decent pain clinic and they just kept changing appointment dates, so I gave up there. Trying to find a good General “practitioner’ here and it’s been useless. The civilians are acting just like the VA with the missing file crap, new nurses, oral surgeons refusing to give my medical file copies, then sent phony ones to protect the VA dental clinic, twice calling in the wrong pharmacies for other scripts, not knowing why the next appointment was set up, and on it goes. Terre Haute, Horrible Haute, is one pathetic, uncaring, corrupt, multiple college college town to live in. So I am told to go back to the VA which I will die first before I allow them to either kill me off their way, on a surgical table while they party, play games, to intentionally disrespect me and others while playing their damn games. OR, it may do in my files that I am drug seeking since everything goes by law enforcement too today. So a person can not win unless your in a clique or connected here.

Over the many years of methods and pain meds that worked to go to zero then deal with the drug game and propaganda is total BS. Get on a balances program, no withdraws, no serious issues, find what works, and doesn’t after many years then the tyrants play their money and control games.

This crap is like going to a emergency room for shot over migraines only to get no relief, but obviously hit with sterile water or something. But we are supposed to play dumb, stay silent, and as one pain MD told me, “Americans are soft, you’re a vet, eat the pain it’s only going to get worse with age.” I think that punk is watching too much TV. And must really abhor the country and people making his office very wealthy.

Or, do what the pain clinic drug counselor said to do…over and over…. ‘hit the streets if you don’t like the VA and medical college’s studies and expectations ( and control) and buy some crack, herion, or go back to drinking.”

The IG and inspectors should be all over Indiana and Terre Haute making a lot of heads roll. In and out of the VA and in every political and media office around here.

Kick them all out of office, drop the stupid laws. We can’t believe anything from the gov or media or from what some stats or claims are made to sway our lives down into more serfdom and misery. But the majority must like living in a police state with nearly no rights or freedoms.

figure8fan
figure8fan

T,
did you see the story on Fox 59 aobut the Marion VAMC abruptly stopping vets pain meds. It was nowhere near what it should have been. I was supposed to take part in that story; however, it “somehow” got reduced to ONLY the Marion VAMC. The question was never answered by the VA (surprised?) about why the vets narcotic pain meds were just stopped and they were stopped by someone the vets had never seen. Someone in an office was making the decision who got any pain meds and how much. No explanation, just “sorry you are no longer going to get these meds”.
This was the story that i turned my VA medical records over to a private doctor who could not believe the VA was doing what they did. Where was this part of the story? It disappeared, it was not allowed to be part of the story. I sent the reporter an e-mail and told her that they really got over on her. The Indy VAMC needs something done quick. They are doing what they want and they make sure the state will do nothing to let the outside people know.
f8f

Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve
Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve

Unfortunately, in the VA most medical decisions are made by bureaucrats and if it is researched many can be held to have violated federal and state statutes, They are arrogant beyond belief.
They must be kicked down the road. And lil’ cocks the onion man too.

T
T

Howdy! Nope, didn’t see the news report. That is another major issue we Terre Haute sheep are supposed to endure is near total censorship. Easy to see and check out for anyone interested. Just go to Topix Terre Haute forum and try to post something negative about this area, town, the far left wing colleges, about poor VA care, about corruption or ask why veterans especially here aren’t being really helped except for what our local media claims to be doing. Ask WHY ARE VETERANS BEING CENSORED AND IGNORED IN TERRE HAUTE. That thread will be down in minutes or a few hours, but usually in minutes. But refuses to address other issues like censoring, threats, giving us false information or making it useless to attend town meetings, even dangerous when a young attorney, the sitting town’s lawyer at the time jumps and stands in front of you while trying to leave in a medical emergency then laughs. Who then also becomes a town attorney.

So what chance do we have? You can’t disagree here or have any form of redress of grievances unless you can hire a high priced attorney, but that too will fail here. Especially living in a town where officials or authorities will enter a home without a warrant or can easily harass a person to death and no-one would be the wiser, or care. A town where officials want life here living on a college campus with no free speech. And another reason why the battles are on many fronts and I am hated here because the cops, city, media, refused to report a killing, vehicle manslaughter, of an old white man on a bicycle to protect a foreign mafia family here (there are many) that has family in the public school admin system, law enforcement, are attorneys, works in local media, Freemasons, country clubbers, sits on councils and appointed positions, professors, works at the VA, etc., so integrity, honor, truth, the Constitution, decency, any real help or investigative reports will not happen. The corruption factor here is beyond belief and all state supported and approved. And is the reason why the nation and veteran’s groups shy away from this town and entire state, and is why no real horrible news never gets out of the state or towns. It just depends on who the victims are or who the perp or criminal is. Is also why all those Mid-Eastern cliques and groups are free to reign and ruin here due to political correctness and their victim whine, but we account for nothing. If we complain or want to discuss something it’s racist, hate, misogyny, from white privilege positions and on it goes. All shown differently on local TV of course. Then we are supposed to trust young medical students fresh out med school, from foreign countries, loved Obama, hates us, and colleges who have two faces to show the public?

This is the reason why national news because of the powers that be will not or rarely report negatives on Indiana or about us being a chronically ill sanctuary state and filled with sanctuary towns and college towns filled with them including MS-13 types, but we hear all is well, we only have issues with white motorcycle types, no other gangs or illegals here. While old governor Mitch Daniels reported on TV he loved Mexicans money coming to the state. He is now over a college and some deals with Hulman & Co. What a laugh.

Nope. Our local new cable TV (TWC went to Spectrum) and satellite system (Direct TV) I switched to, have dropped all Indianapolis channels. We can just get the regular national MSM like ABC, Faux, NBC, etc. Then of course the loser propagandist and liars here locally with WTHI, WTWO, who claim when called to “have all the news you really need.” and they flat out refuse to report anything needful or dealing with some reality. So how is all that for having some enemies in a small corrupt college town play the roll of decency and truth?
That includes mainly the left and includes the local unions, all branches of service. It is dog eat dog here and vote a certain way to get jobs, city or county work, to run for office, to to get decent treatment away from all the self-serving and corruption. The local cliques, cabals, mafias, syndicates, country clubbers, etc., first and foremost and to hell with the rest of us.

Around thirty years ago I tried to expose what this state and TH is all about but failed back then too. As a union officer, and other positions tried calling in the Feds for help. No go. I contacted the show “60 Minutes” and others. At first they were all gung-ho until a day or later called back saying they had enough stories about corruption and their producers didn’t want to come to Indiana. So that was a failed attempt at something like that after several tries over the years. Showed me what Indiana was, is, and is a hands-off open air prison camp with plenty to keep buried, run and controlled by the corrupt, families, groups, and being foreigner controlled including the cliques, government agencies/pedophiles/pervs and bought off Agenda 21 to globalist communitarian fascist professionals/colleges. All while passing “tolerance ordinances” and the want for more hate speech laws to silence us. And to never know who this system has killed, abused, murdered, or worse…completely ignored on all and every level of life.

I will be starting a FB group for Hoosier vets too about these issues. Even though the locals here out of self preservation will not want to be included or even know of such a evil American veteran and Christian/other such as myself. It may cost them dearly, like a job or a favor from the city council or something.

This is all why websites like Ben’s is so important and needful. Problem is getting people concerned for us and other humans instead of being consumed by all the distractions out there or what color of panties Kardashians or Hillary is wearing.

That is why going against the VA system here in a lost cause. Golla, Howard, and several others at the VA are some of the worse I have ever dealt with. Many of the staff too. I have tried to get the ear of every office in Indiana and locally and all I have done is made a ton more of enemies and being totally ignored which is common. There are networks, okay call them conspirators out there and they are not there to help us or to help spread needful change or info. They are out there to destroy, silence, withhold info, mis-inform, delay, and cover-up.

Try to have a good night ya’ all. I wish I could say change is a coming but that would be a lie. Or that after all these years I have a little more hope, I don’t. Lost it all in modern humanity and in Indiana. I think we all can see the writing on the wall. God help the brain-washed, socially engineered youth, along with future veterans of this country.

Take care over there f8f!

OLDMARINE
OLDMARINE

T…….GOOD RANT…….hands-off open air prison camp…had me laughing on that one. how true it is

Lem
Lem

Not done properly means withdrawal seizures possibly ending in death and often with methadone maintenance. I don’t understand why methadone isn’t used as a pain killer because it is supposed to be non progressive the way most pain killers are. The longer you are on opioids the more it takes for the same results.

namnibor
namnibor

Methadone is one of the VA’s favorite RX’s to dispense right next to Gabapentin. When I utilized the VA Deathcare they had me on huge doses of methadone specifically as a first attack on pain. It did not help me and made me sick so the VA turned up the volume with morphine, lots of it.

Not on any of it these days, yet am in pain but cope in various other ways, better than the pain in the ass always having to justify to yet another new resident that I do not wish to be a pin cushion for the next best addictive thing. Some of that happened to me in just the last year and half with private medical and Medicare…but the hacks were also doing residency requirements at the local VA…scary monsters.

OLDMARINE
OLDMARINE

namnibor………….Gabapentin the wonder drug,..Yeeee..haaaa got rid of my brain and no more pain…and ooooooo what a relief it is ….I think it was the Alka-Seltzer commercial LOL

Dennis
Dennis

I was on methadone for a long time as a pain killer. It is highly effective and lasts MUCH longer than morphine. Let me explain why it is seldom prescribed or if prescribed a patient will question it – morality. Methadone is forever tied to another word Lem; “clinics”. Since drug addiction has been tied to morality by the Christian tradition and since, like it or not, we are a nation still largley guided by the Christian ethos then the use of methadone is tied to immorality. There is no logic that can penetrate morality. Methadone clinics, or rather the humans that use their services, have been characterized as immoral. Methadone is seen in the public ONLY as a drug used to ease the pain of heroin withdraw, despite the fact it makes a DAMN effective pain killer for all kinds of pain types.

This is because folks on methadone are on it because of a SEVERE medical issue called addiction. The underlying motivation for an addict is very simple – feed the addiction. The only possible way to do that for most humans is to engage in high profit activities otherwise illegal like prostituion, theft, and even murder if the murder is necessary to obtain the drugs. It is stigma Lem pure and simple. I do not read right or wrong into this at all, because it is just the way it is.

Look yourself at all the posts that Ben has done over time. Have you noticed something unique about vets who post and admit (usually via an angry story) that they either were or are currently using opiate/opiode? I have.

These are decent people on the most powerful drug known throughout history to hold men in its grips. The VA provides us vets collectively with mountains of pills of all varieties, yet it is a RARE instance for somebody who is put on a reduced dosage of lets say an anti-depressent to make a post on this blog that discusses in high detail the case for attempting to maintain or increase the dose. Not so with the folks on morphine.

What I have noticed is behavior I actively engaged in myself. I was on 180 mg/day morphine and 40 mg/day hydrocodone. These were explained to me to be life shortening doses. A close friend of mine died of hyper agressive liver cancer after several years on morphine. She seemed happy and healthy then a week later she was dead – a consequence of long time morphine use and a typical story. This is the difference between morphine using folks and say folks who use the hypothetical anti-depressent. A morphine user often will post several paragraphs blasting VA for reducing the morphine dose, and nearly ALL of those paragraphs present an extremely thorough medical synopsis as if to a jury as to why the medical decision was flawed.

Look at the angry posts today; within any post except this one have you ever seen any vet using morphine or addicted to it as I am post the obvious fact that morphine is a life shortening drug? You might see a few posts here and there in which a vet vows to kill themselves if the drug is removed, but not one post generally acknowledges that long term opiode use is deadly. Most dismiss that idea in two seconds, but will pounce on the VA idea of using dirty dentist drills. In other words Lem, the difference between users of other drugs and morphine is that morphine users will ALWAYS be involved with making a case not only to maintain their dosing levels but nearly ALWAYS will tie morphine and opiate to quality of life even while knowing the pills are shortening just that.

I used to use gabapentin as well until VA terminated that too. I have severe axonal peripheral sensorimotor polyneuropathy with severe restless leg syndrome attached. I decide to see what life was like off of gabapentin. I went from 800 mg per day to zero. For two solid months I tossed and turned at night and if it is possible for every single hair follicle to itch horribly, even eyelashes, then that is what happened. You think morphine withdrawl is bad? Hehee, brother just try doing what I did and come off high doses of gabapentin! My morphine withdraws were a cake walk compared – yet how many vets would make a post longer than three sentences to make a case to be put back on gabapentin?

More to the point, how many vets would continue taking gabapentin if they were informed it was blowing up their liver? My hunch is zero. How many vets continue taking morphine knowing full well it is blowing up their liver? All of them. Let me be very clear – I fought hard to keep my VA prescription and was willing to die an early painful death in order to keep popping those pills. I ONLY ceased taking them when VA refused to provide any more. Lem, this issue is NOT about pain, a topic I understand very well indeed. This issue is about veterans fighting to maintain their addiction to morphine and opiode drugs, and NOT about good medical practice which first and foremost is defined as “First, Do No Harm.”

I am gonna duck now. I think I hear an airborn cabbage headed my way…

OLDMARINE
OLDMARINE

Dennis ……I’m on cabbage mountain you should get it shortly

namnibor
namnibor

No cabbage headed your way from me, as I indeed consider those drugs *deadly*, and only to be utilized when and if absolutely necessary.

I have learned to live with both extreme emotional and physical pain. My coping mechanism is creativity and life itself. Also, cannabis is WAY more effective and…non-addictive. Win/Win.

T
T

I envy those who can use or attain cannabis legally. Anything that’s good for the body is illegal in Indiana. Illinois just a few miles away where they can get it. I have too many enemies in high places to attempt such things. Like I need to do anything wrong for the door to be opened or caught out in my yard again, or driving.

I was going to try Kratom since hearing about it. By the time I got the news on that and used with other herbs it was made illegal here too. Now I am being told it’s illegal to do my own acupuncture or to try to purchase those items. Just can’t win.

The local officials told me if I didn’t like living in a town that’s like a tyrant controlled college campus to move. I tried that too over the years. People and three companies wanted to buy me out. Guess what, the city, the zoning board, others, said I could not sell my property to them due to zoning rules, the city not wanting dirty jobs or companies like a scrap yard coming here, or railroad type train car repairs coming within the city limits. Then they laugh about it and say “don’t bother filing an appeal…you’ll lose.” Nice place Indiana. Corrupt top to bottom.

All that is left to try is Miner’s Lettuce, a old green. They will make that illegal too as soon as the tyrants read this post or hear of it. But then knowing how things are here they can pop me for lettuce and call it Mary Gee Wanna and I go to prison for being a non-conformist and threat to the NWO.

namnibor
namnibor

@OLDMARINE- Do you have one of those ‘Salad Shooters’? Or since it’s cabbage, would that be a ‘Stir-Fry Slingshot’? 🙂

OLDMARINE
OLDMARINE

namnibor ……..NO JUST A 80,000 POUND TRUCK LOADED WITH CABBAGE COMING DOWN CABBAGE MOUNTAIN. IT SHOULD MAKE IT TO DENNIS HE CAN ALWAYS MAKE SAUERKRAUT FOR THE MUNCHIES LOL….EAT HEALTHY

Nexdeceptus
Nexdeceptus

Thanks Dennis. I didn’t know about the liver thing with the Gabapentin. I,m taking 600 mg a day for my Spondylosis and it’s not doing much good and I don’t want to up the dose. So I just quit. Guess I’ll have to take more of my Cannabutter.

T
T

I’ve got, had, over 20 yrs in recovery circles, helping manage recovery club, twelve step calls, my own little ministry stuff, seen plenty of suffering and death, stood by and watched helplessly while end of life meds were being kept from dying patients due to the rule and statistics games. I have taken people in suicide situation to the local mental health care hospital only to be told by some college intern idiot, ‘the patient or person isn’t serious enough.’ While I am holding a T-shirt on their cut wrists or stab wounds. Name it I’ve seen it or dealt with it. Heard vets talk of suicide then immediately walk away and death happens then claimed accidental. Well yes.

I am also aware of why I walked away from doing so much volunteer work and trying to help people. It’s impossible to do when a government or agency wants to use phony statistics or studies to enhance issues like addiction that don’t exist. Bad yes, to the present extent or claims? Prove it to me instead of squawking on TV or keeping news or events out of local news, or spouting reports that simply can not be verified. Yet the power runs rampant as does the profits for the prison industry to legal thefts like property or money confiscation. Or reporting about ‘accidental overdoses’ when I have too many times it be actual suicides then claimed accidental for insurance reasons, of course.

I have seen too many use the dope and drug game or excuses knowing full well they often get breaks in punishment for claiming the dope or Devil made them do it. It is a well used game but is never discussed in polite corrupt society. Of course they will say they were drunk or doped if all they have to do is pay for the drug court and fees, play the games, and walk away from serious crimes to only do it again and claim the same causes. Even if there is nothing but booze in their system it is used as the fascist wish to use the new statistic.

Over the years I have been asked if I wanted an increase in pain meds or by a dentist something for pain. I would say no or I have pain meds at home and don’t need a script. And this was years before the fascist came along with their Draconian demands which leave no room for oh oh ….. personal responsibility. No instead they get a vet’s eye candy wife to get on TV and boast about the evils of over-dosing when the vet actually claimed he was going to kill himself and to leave the kids and commercial wife the insurance money. This is not rare, but the sheep will buy anything on TV. Even ‘Thigh Master.”

Common sense dictates you can’t keep ruining your tolerance with more pills. If I took more than one Hydro it was for good reasons. If I had to dip in my “break through pain meds” given to me I did. Being stupid I did take a bunch back to the VA and turned it in for the trash. Or to be yelled at if I dumped them in the wrong garbage can. If both old standards failed, I would have to go visit the ER for shots that became questionable to non functioning. But told I was given enough to drop a horse which is horse shit.

Gaba was a joke. I couldn’t function on it and could not get to the higher clinical doses they wanted me on. One woman said she was on over 1000 mg a day of that damn stuff and I don’t see how. That and their demands or have my file flagged for being uncooperative tried their wonder drugs called anti-psychotics, Ambilify and other anti-depressants for chronic pain. Tried without my pain meds, and no withdrawals from them either. Missed them but no severe Jones. Their wonder drugs was the most horrible withdrawals I have ever had in my life. Horrible. And they wanted to do is add more head dope on me. No way. I have also lost count of people, kids, ending their lives due to the side effects of Gaba and other stupid drugs. Like using or being switched to Gaba for epilepsy or seizures. One young man left his grand parents house stating what he was going to do and did it eating some lead. So there are some difficult discussions to be had and many will not like it.

I have been without pain meds for a long time now and all it has done is bottom me out, immobilize me to no end and make life miserable. And I am damn good, an expert, at staying at home and suffering. Did it before the grand VA game and doing it now.

As stated before. Liver MD and specialist told me to never take certain meds again. No over the counter stuff, no NSAIDs or very little, no arthritis medicines, no Tylenol. Only to use narcs for pain. No cholesterol meds either. I got a call at midnight one time and told by the VA neuro to get off of some of those meds,, immediately. I did and put back on narcs for pain and liver enzymes came down. But now I am told to do what other said not to do. And the VA said to forget whatever we were told in the past or from outside specialist. So go figure.

The real harm is health care forcing people into multiple bankruptcies for medical care or going without food and such for meds. The entire system is broken. Everybody wants to control and rule over others and to hell with individual needs and a Constitution or common courtesy or decency. We are not all alike like the VA and other socialist claim or think. Hell, you should see what the VA and civilian hospitals do to those who need end of life meds while filed as DO NOT RESUSCITATE patients. Walk through the doors when they are telling family, friends, their ministers or end of life coach to wait for hours till they are cleaned up to see some reality. They will lay there alone, in filth, no pain meds, suffering, because they are shoved in room to expire in horrible ways. I have seen this also too many times. Who cares? The damn new age health care quacks or nurses polishing their designer nails at their stations. The family don’t want to create upset but follow demands from those controlling the situation. Like most others want to control our lives from beginning to end and that is the way it is.

I will eat the cabbage with some corned beef. No use wasting good food. lol I do get your drift.

namnibor
namnibor

@T-

I just came back from a few trips to Indiana. Very rural farm country Indiana, for my father’s funeral. Although I have not lived in Indiana since I was 17 years old, my family is there so I have an insight into the HORRIBLE heroin and opioid epidemic there, and get this: although I grew-up in the smallest county of Indiana, it now has the highest poverty and heroin and opioid crisis.

It’s so bad, I have parts of my own family that let themselves become slaves to this terrible class of drugs.
So terrible, farmers have been having farm equipment stolen or my favorite, aluminum siding ripped-off equipment sheds or even farmhouses themselves to be sold for scrap…to support yet ONE MORE USED NEEDLE or a Pig Pharma Phat Cat getting another stock doubling and splitting.

Who’s “winning” here? Certainly not the farmers. Phat Cats at Pig Pharma….while the zombie heroin apocalypse carries-on just out of their blinders.

The heroin AND opioid crisis is INDEED VERY REAL!

I also lost a very good Veteran buddy some 6 years ago when the VA cut-off his meds and made him report to the Disruptive Behavior Stormtroopers….he, like Dennis, got BANNED from the VA….so, he went right to the streets and low and behold, after three months, he gets some heroin laced with fentanyl and I found his lifeless body.
From my perspective and from my State of Ohio’s perspective, the CRISIS is VERY REAL.
It’s actually a GOOD THING to feel some of your pain, whether emotional or physical, as it lets you know you are still alive.

T
T

Sorry about your loss.

Oh yeah it is bad here but there is more to it than them on the news calling it all opiates and such. It’s like our vast epidemic of HIV, Hep C, Cancer rates through the roof, beyond epidemic proportions, gangs, etc. Then have the legal system bounce around with media saying no crime here, we are great here, to having extreme issues, so which is it?

Only once on the news did they report just one person (one newer case, female) intentionally spreading HIV. Veterinarian meds hit the streets and mixed with stuff that they are calling ‘prescription opiates’ among other fashionable labels to suit their war on drugs. Animal meds, horse to elephant tranquilizers and such should not be reported as human prescribed pain meds. Bath-tub made dope should not be called “prescription opiates.” It’s like calling the multitude of suicides as “accidental over-doses.” Who or what are we going to do in these cases? personally it is not my job or in volunteer status to rat people out or discuss things with family or the law. Nobody gives a damn about my experiences or what I know and have seen. What’s done is done, insurance paid, commercials made about the “accidents”, done deal. It would create too much more heart ache and loss or more suicides, who knows. We aren’t supposed to dare question the official narrative on anything the news reports say or what some so-called expert or cop claims as total truth or needs.

First reports came out years ago from here and southern Indiana (Washington) about the epidemic spread of sexually transmitted disease by the homosexual community. That story was dropped due to PC-ness and replaced with it all being from drug usage, evil veterans and pain meds, and needle activities. So the entire truth about things is not allowed out. All the problems still exist but the focus is off point to mislead the public as usual. Now it’s all about we need mo money more controls more laws, more money don’t forget.

I am trying to show a juxtaposition here but not doing so well, I think. I dunno. It’s like people demanding we be tolerant here and keep illegals and crime out of the news. But yet, since they put in the national roads to I-69 here the drug scene has exploded. But don’t blame open borders or the illegals bringing it in.

I always tried to help kids through life and from the school bullies. When this town is run by bullies and corruption. You can’t talk to youth today because it may hurt the family or parents. Might shame the country clubbers and community elite. Tell the parents to stop giving the kids money, credit cards and a Cadillac to drive around to get dope, they miss the point. Kids die from booze, alcohol poisoning, dope, then parents and others just want to shut down the news and communication about it all. You can’t get it through peoples heads that idiots out there and college kiddies are mixing up chemicals of all sorts then selling them as opiates when they should be called street angel dust or PCP. Then on the flip-flop the city and colleges have made “drunk walks” legal in college towns for home coming or whatever. Then bitch when they have to go have their stomachs pumped or die from poisoning. Or people like me aren’t cool because we don’t want to see youth being misled or allowed to ruin a college career learning how to booze it up and drug with unknown items. Then refuse to report what was in their systems at the time…in total. It also doesn’t help for the ‘leaders’ to allow youth to run nuts and only be concerned with entertainment, sports and that doping and bullying, to Hollywood trash for several hours in a day and at school.

It’s a deep subject but such war crime crap like “collective punishment” or socialized health care for and equally is not the answer either. Especially when the politicians, the elite, can get whatever they need and desire or have their own separate health care systems unlike what we evil peasants and vets have to endure since we are all alike. We are not all alike like cops claim or the VA and government claims is truth or the way it is. WE can’t teach common sense most of the time, just like personal responsibility or allow nature to happen to the misled and ignorant people. Or being called a racist for wanting change in ‘colored neighborhoods’ or in the big cities because dope dealing is the only way to make big money or a way out. I don’t have answers to the myriad of questions and problems. Wish I did. I do know there are countless kids and people out there unable to handle real life due to modern American ways and PC-ness. Too many scared and no hope for the future but to find a feel good way to numb out. Or intentionally die easily enough.

Have a good day. I gotta make a physical move or rigor will set in worse than it is.

Robert Dean Rose Jr.
Robert Dean Rose Jr.

Safe taper? How is this for safe taper? Christina Craft, Advanced Practice Registered Nurse, License Number 21419, Licensed only in TN at Mountain Home VAMC, Johnson City TN, started my on a taper mid-October 2016 by telephone. She had no clue about my medical history. I went from 180mg Morphine Sulfate (3x60mg tablet – daily) to zero by December 29th, 2016. My blood pressure went through the ceiling and is still acting up months later. Solution they doubled three separate BP meds so now I every time I stand up I have to go to the bathroom. Then again after getting me to 30mg daily, she also tried to take me back to 120mg daily mid-December because of the uncontrolled blood pressure and anger issues. Believing this to be dangerous, I declined so she offered me Meloxicam; a NSAID. All is good except the manufacture warns not to take if you have high blood pressure, high cholesterol, depression or diabetes! Guess what I have all four! In March 2017 I finally was appointed a new PCP: Dr. Mark Vernon.

Dr. Mark Vernon, Family Medicine, Tennessee medical license #22157, expired September 30, 1998. His Arizona license #22357 expires January 21, 2019.. On Wednesday, May 17, 2017, he again denied pain medications. However, and this is the confusing part, he did encourage me to continue smoking (cigarettes) as they would help relieve the stress from all the frustration and anger. Ok, I get that but then, knowing I am diabetic; he also encouraged me to continue drinking Mt. Dew. His reasoning for this sound medical advice is that the sugar molecules in the soda would attach to pain receptors and block the pain signals in my body. Does this is in any way make sense to anyone? If so, please explain!

Then again on the same date Dr. Vernon stated there was not really wrong with my spine based on the latest MRI results from the Johnson City Medical Center. In fact he minimized the degree of damage to the point that he diagnoses my current condition as being fibromyalgia despite the fact these some of these conditions date back to 1991 and are documented in my military records. The conditions listed from the MRIs completed on May 5th, 2017 & May 12th, 2017 are as follows:

1. Disc osteophyte complex develops and a series of bone spurs form on multiple vertebrae, the space surrounding the intervertebral discs becomes compressed, and there is a danger of the osteophytes in the spine exerting pressure on the nerve roots or the spinal cord. It is this neural compression that causes symptoms like localized pain, pain that radiates to the extremities, tingling, numbness or a pins-and-needles sensation.
2. Uncovertebral hypertrophy is the enlargement of small synovial joints found in the upper surfaces of the bodies of the lower cervical vertebrae and the inferior surface of the superior vertebral body. The enlargement of these neck joints and pain are a common symptoms of degenerative neck disease.
3. Schmorl’s node itself is a cause of pain. This may not be the main cause; often these are found with disc herniations or disc degeneration that can cause radiating pain as well as modic changes in the bone at other locations than the node.
4. Facet arthropathy, which simply means a disease or abnormality of the facet joints, causes pain and discomfort associated with the degeneration and arthritis to various parts of the spine.
5. Near complete effacement of the anterior thecal sac which means the protective membrane covering the spinal cord is experiencing extra pressure and causing pain.

So bottom line, the VA apparatus simply wants to kill as many veterans as possible. I for one am not going to go without a fight.

Thank you, take care and may God bless.

“Teufelshunde”

Respectfully,

Robert D. Rose Jr.
BSW, MEd., USMC
Semper Fidelis

We defended your freedoms…
Will you support America in her time of need?

Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve
Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve

Semper fi to you, Brother and give the Attorney General of Ohio a call

T
T

Fibromyalgia, I was told at the VA that is not a recognized medical affliction and cannot be diagnosed, proven, let alone treated. Migraines were put on the list too about four or five years ago here.

I have many of the same issues and the spinal stenosis, degenerative disks, neck, thoracic, lumbar, sacral, etc. My neck cannot be messed with at all, even by chiropractors. I do use a soft neck brace at times and a neck traction unit.

After falling a few years back because of my ankles and knees not being able to engage properly all the time or going up or down stairs forced me to pay high dollars for a Medic Alert. That is when I found out medically, ha ha, that all my joints are wrecked in some way and can’t be trusted. But the VA and local MDs think it’s all okay, said I had to learn how to “minimize the pain I think I feel.” Yeah, right. So now it’s in both hips that complete my whole body is in need for a complete over-haul or re-build. lol So about every move I make has to be mindful, anticipated, firmly made or else I deal with the consequences. Like driving and almost getting hit by some fool on a cell phone makes me turn the neck too fast will pop and instant headache and nerves running wild to puking. And the cops are not “social workers” and couldn’t care less why your at the side of the road barfing or trying to get pulled back together again or laying in the back of my truck due to the pains, fast movements, or near misses. They are trained to throw around, yell, push, etc. So I don’t get out much anymore either. Not without my own body cam. Lol

TENS units and pain patches are useless and a waste of money.

Locals are too afraid to discuss these matters. Especially when bad medicine and treatments are the cause of some issues.

Windguy
Windguy

RDRose and T. Have either of you researched DISH Syndrome? Diffuse Intervertebral Spinal Hyperostosis? AKA Diffuse Idiopathic Skeletal Hyperostosis. It does not appear to be in the VA playbook. It is often initially misdiagnosed as Ankylosing Spondylitis, which, requires a specific genetic marker. Episodes of severe pain occur when a bridging osteophyte stabs into or near the spine. This lasts sometimes for months until the bridging process is complete, and the disc is essentail fused with new bone.

I was finally diagnosed with it around 2002, after a whole lot of BS when I could afford the $1200/mo (each) insurance. Five years ago I had to succumb to the VA freebie. You get what you pay for, in spite of the down-payment we all made. NSAIDs worked for a while, and subsequently fragged my esophagus – forever. My “file” states boldly “NO NSAIDS”. After the visit to the Pain Specialist backfired (Trigger Point Injections) I was sent back to my PCP for “options including a Rheumy or neurologist. Sure enough, my newest reading impaired PCP said, “we could try some new NSAIDs”…. I lectured, and she recommended combining NSAIDs with heavy doses of PPI’s (Nexium and other). I had to lecture again – it’s all in my file. Finally, the idiot gets back to me and says, “well, DISH does not appear to be treatable, so I don’t see what an MRI will tell us”…. Me: “Ah, maybe, just maybe I have a common treatable form of stenosis”

She’ll get back to me. Meanwhile, I’ve been sampling enough CBD cannabis to know it isn’t BS placebo. That shit works just about as good as NSAIDs for pain management. Plus, you get a buzz. The side effect is a possible eating disorder also known as the munchies. Acupuncture seems very effective during the early and late stages of bridging hyperostosis. Presently, it’s blowing through the acute phase and has provided no relief. Look for Traditional Chinese Medicine accredited acupuncturists. The chiropractors that took a month or two of acu don’t get it the job done.

As for fybromyalgia – my wife has lived with it most of her adult life. It’s real, and the AMA crowd have no clue. Their responses range from “It’s all in your head” to “fuck off”. However, symptomolgy is very similar to post-acute stage Lyme. I’ve often wondered if DISH isn’t a form of Lyme. Some docs on the fringe would agree. Nobody knows.

Take away. Back pain clusterfuckdom is not exclusive to the VA. However, the VA does score highest in clusterfuckdom when it comes to back-pain “treatment”. Lose weight (big challenge for all of us), control inflammation (booze, sugars, wheat, sugars, coffee, sugars), Tai Chi, and breathe…

OLDMARINE
OLDMARINE

LOOK INTO THIS…”https://www.georgekramermd.com/prolozone”

T
T

Thanks for the link. It will be useful. A local dentist was telling me about that and the hyperbolic chambers. Said it would help heal my broken jaw the VA dentist did, but she refused to X-ray for and put in my files that the inner jaw, mandible was extremely shattered from the back molar into the mandible hinge and deep muscle structures. She called it “that issue.” More of that protective “Professional Courtesy” crap.

A local spa has one for women and the hospital here that has one is expensive, needs MD prescription and Medicare won’t cover any of the cost for the needed treatments. But I am still checking around. I can use this link to see if it would harm a arterial aneurysm, descending.

OLDMARINE
OLDMARINE

T….I had that in my favorites read about it awhile ago was going to give the guy a call but cant afford it either….I got some oil yesterday but doesn’t seem to do much yet.. I tried kratom….I’ll try anything to get pain relief..LOL….AND DOCTORS ARE JUST TURDS IN WHITE TRENCH COAT’S….SEE YA AT THE VATICAN….WE NEED TO TOSS HIM OUT AND STEAL HIS BOOKS THE FUCKING HYPOCRITE …..he said something negative about guns once, come to find out they are major share holders in BERETTA ARMS….

T
T

Beretta Arms? Didn’t know that. Glad to learn something new every day.

I had to leave a couple of so-called bible colleges and to get formerly ordained pursuant to state/church laws, but couldn’t handle the revisionist of history, the BS, brain-washing, secrecy, or what or what not to believe. They were as bad as my adventures at those far left liberal arts colleges. Just trash, social engineering, trains ignorant activist, PC-ness out the wazoo, forces complete allegiances, have their own agendas and some not so American, Christian, or Constitutional centered. But were supposed to put some foreigners first before America or real Christianity at all cost. Ahem, nope, not me. Cough cough.

Tried to get into some different monasteries but I didn’t have the wealth to cash in for that. So I could run and hide from evil society and it’s ilk. lol They have a lost of secrets too I suppose.

Yes, I’d like to get into all those secrets and archives all over that are forbidden to us peons that accepted academics or lying researchers writing their books get. Guess I may get there in another lifetime to see the dungeons, Lourdes, the body of Bernadette preserved, skull filled caverns of Paris, or to feel a pyramid. lol

Not in shape to go visit the Bunny Ranch in Nevada. Too damn old, feeble and sick to sin. LOL Damn it. I won’t be able to die the death of my young dreams.

Angela
Angela

@T, in one of your posts you were speaking about the public not knowing the complete picture about the veterans with not getting such good wrap particularly when it relates to the use of addictive drugs like the Opoids. Actually, the private sector is determining particularly in the State of Massachusetts that the Opoid Epidemic problem is pointing to Non-Citizens. This epidemic from what is being determined from research so far is due to the drugs coming from outside of this country with these Non – Citizens.
As for doctoring in this country with humaneness and appropriate care for weaning off the Opoids, it is almost does not exist. Honestly, I believe that the Twelve Step programs are most helpful as compared to the Medical providers except when in just cases of overdose or withdrawals that require other medical means to stabilize the person. The streamlining of any drug should be done with decrementing the dosage levels and while decrementing the dosages another drug may could be applied to ease the withdrawal pains. These drugs really alter the neurotransmitters in the brain and when decreasing the dosages the rest of the body has got to adjust. When the gradual tapering off is occurring, this is when intensive therapy and support should be added to the regime to assist the psyche to adjust to the change. This would entail the development of more substantative coping skills that have to do with developing a tolerance from being removed from the drug, redeveloping brain functioning such as the memory, reaction time, problem solving skills and the list goes on. When anyone tapers off these drugs, an intense recovery is necessary to be able to get a handle on living life on life’s terms. I find that many of the VA providers either do not care due to a Socialism system or really do not understand how the weaning process is absolutely necessary for a period of time for the person to reach coherent a drug free state of mind or a very streamlined medicated state of mind particularly with being at least free from the addictive drugs. Tapering off any drug is hard work and takes lots of efforts to degrees of infinity in order for one to survive. Best. Comment more later.

James Clement
James Clement

@Angela – – – Agree with all you have written this post. Twelve Step programs can be very effective. I have personal experience with those. And yes, tapering off any drug is very hard work.

I have found by and large that VA providers do not understand much of anything that makes good sense.

ANutterVet
ANutterVet

Tapering. How much does that take to learn how to taper down BENFICIARY’s (Veterans)? This article has forced me to come out and report, that the VA was going to recklessly cut off 95% of my monthly amount of pain medication. My VA PCP is Fucking Dangerous. VA PCP was fired by me right after I found out that my pain medications were dramatically reduced by a whooping 95%.

I’m demanding that my new VA PCP to be licensed in my State where I reside, and must have experience in Pain Management. What’s crazy is that my local VA has a Pain Management Department, with a Pain Management Physician, but the Pain Management Physician doesn’t cut out the prescriptions to be used for pain relief.

In my past VA arrangement, my PCP was a Nurse Practitioner [NP], and would prescribe me my pain medication for the month. But all of this will have to change for the positive, in order for me to trust the VA.

As far as the illicit drug theft of Controlled Scheduled Substances, the FBI needs to be called in since the VA Executive Management, has no idea where the drugs are being stolen from Pharmacy Distribution Network, and there is no enthusiasm for Top Management to be interested in conduct, ethics, or standards in the complex VA System. Go figure.

Right now there are only about 30% AFGE VA Employees that are BENEFICIARY’s (Veterans) in the VA network. This should be increased to 70% BENEFICIARY’s (Veterans) working in the VA System. Whether the dam AFGE Union is involved with the VA or not. – – – Nutter Reporting on Thursday, June 1, 2017.

Robert Dean Rose Jr.
Robert Dean Rose Jr.

Targeted Cities List – Used to develop policies to blame the veterans and to hide the actual numbers of veteran suicide as well as the number of deaths from natural causes by a veteran being tapered or denied… (Based on my research many locals are still missing)
Minneapolis, Minnesota – 2012
St. Cloud, Minnesota – 2012
Fargo, Minnesota – 2012
Bedford, Massachusetts – 2013
Roanoke, Virginia – 2014
Dayton, Ohio – 2014
Columbus Ohio – 2014
Show Low, AZ – December 2014
Orlando, Florida – 2015
Walla Walla, Washington – 2015
Baltimore. MD – 2016
Hagerstown Clinic, VA – 2016
Johnson City, Tennessee – 2016
Eglin AFB, Florida – 2016
Marion, IL – 2016
Martinsburg, WV – 2016
Viera, Florida – 2016
Tomah, Wisconsin – 2016
Leavenworth, Kentucky – Spring 2017

Veteran Suicides (that I could find)…
Peter Kaisen, 76-year old of Islip, NY – Navy veteran suffering from chronic back pain outside a veteran’s hospital in New York being denied pain medications.
Daniel Somers, 30 – Army – Operation Iraqi Freedom – Denied pain medications – June 10. 2013
Kevin Keller – US Navy – Denied pain medications
Ryan Trunzo – US Army – Denied pain medications
Zach Williams – US Army – Denied pain medications
Travis “Patt” Patterson – US Army 01/27/2017 – Denied Pain Medications, also PTSD – Topeka VAMC, Kansas, MO
Bryan Spece – USMC – Denied Pain Medications – Benefis Pain Management Center, Great Falls, Montana

Denied Mental Healthcare
Richard Miles – US Army 02/20/2015 – Mental Health – PTSD VAMC, Des Moines, IA–
Todd Ray – US Army –
Stephen J Bowling – 2016
Mark Nichols – August 2015 – PTSD

Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve
Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve

There are also two deaths due to the actions of the former Director of Psychiatry and Psychology/Mental Health in Washington, D.C. who was fired by the Inspector General but got his job back by going on active duty with the U.S. Navy in the same geographical area, (he was a reserve Navy Commander) and coming back four years later to the VA with all of his raises and promotions he would have gotten as if he had never been fired. He was the Director of Mental Health but he held no degree in Psychology, nor did he have a degree in Psychiatry nor even was he a medical doctor;
He had a “Doctor of Education ” degree!!!????
We will never drain the swamp at the VA if we agree to the “repair” of the VA. Dump the VA let private doctors administer care, (real doctors who have served their residencies in US medical schools who are 5 star rated and who can speak English.
Let private attorneys adjudicate the compensation and the money, instead of supporting incompetent “I don’t give a shit bureaucrats and bully junior Psychologists and doctors who couldn’t get a job in private medicine, let the money go to where it was designed to go, to the veteran. TIME IS UP, NO MORE BULLSHIT CHARGES FOR “ACTING OUT” as they tried to pull on me, (however unsuccessfully). Come on guys! We are the former U.S. Army, Navy, Marines, Coastguard, let’s get going. No more little arguments as to who the best is, DAV, American Legion, VFW, time to coagulate, Air Force Bombs, Navy Fires Artillery, Army and Marines take the beach and then some……………(Coast Guard screens for bad boys) United we stand, (and prevail), divided we fall (and fail). Ben’s doing a hell of a job let’s give him some real support.
HOORAH> Like Bobby Darin said “If you ain’t goin’ my way, GET OUT OF MY WAY!!”
Semper Fi

James Clement
James Clement

@Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve – – – Sir, are you referring to Silvio Weisner? Around Sept. 2015 I believe?

Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve
Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve

No this was prior to that and he’s baaack and doing his dirty bureaucratic stuff without ever being penalized

Seymore Klearly
Seymore Klearly

Nice work Robert Dean Rose.

Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve
Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve

Nurse Practioners and Physicians Assistants have taken over the diagnostic duties in the VA and it is a Ripoff and a violation of several federal statutes. Why do we stand for such a lowering of the standard duty of due care?
When you go to see a private doctor, you SEE a private DOCTOR.

Most Physicians who take Medicare also charge an additional fee but the only doctors to whom ‘CHOICE’ refers veterans to are doctors who will accept only Medicare payments and thus the doctors to whom veterans are referred to are by and by lesser qualified doctors.
The clinic I was referred to got two stars, bad references, (but they have several in this area) and the clinic was described by persons who had been there as dirty filthy, and the non doctor personnel as rude and incompetent. WHY IS THIS TRUE. I BELIEVE THAT THE attempted IMPROVEMENT ALLEGED BY THE NEW SEC OF VETERANS AFFAIR IS A RUSE AND AS WE HAVE LEARNED NO ONE WHO HAS CAUSED THE DEATHS OF VETERANS HAVE BEEN HELD CULPABLE FOR THOSE CRIMES WHICH CONSTITUTE AT THE MINIMUM NEGLIGENT HOMICIDE. WHAT IS UP, FELLOW VETERANS.
LAWSUITS LAWSUITS LAWSUITS, WHAT ARE WE WAITING FOR ??!! Contact Rod Rosenstein the Deputy Attorney General Push, Push, Push.

Windguy
Windguy

Flot: Pig Pharma and Pig Med in the private sector are rolling out PAs and Nurse Practitioners at just as fast a rate as the VA – IMO. A “practitioner” can prescribe drugs which serves Pig Pharma very nicely. There just aren’t enough doctors to push the myriad profit generating drugs. Lobbying isn’t cheap.

Jo3n
Jo3n

Accountability is vital, but having the VA follow the law is equally vital. We can’t hold them accountable if they don’t have to follow the law. They don’t have to follow the law, if we can’t hold them accountable. Dr Shulkin, and President Trump, make the VA obey the law and only then can we hold them accountable. Other than that, the rest of this shit will always be shit. We are tired. You’re in your first year.

cj
cj

The Hungry Hippo Holler:

Hungry hungry hippo, or the oompa loompa dance
You think you can fire us, but you ain’t got a chance

We don’t speak no English, We ain’t gonna go
We get paid more than you, so fuck off gi Joe

Little tiny teenie weenie pills in a box
We are led by one big fat ass who’s name is lil cox

Forever we been screwing you out of all that we owe you
It’s done with your leaders blessing this is nothing new

Your senators and congressmen are taller than a giraffe
It’s just you’ve never seen them with their heads out of their ass

One day you will say “we have had enough”
Until that day comes You gonna have it rough.

We hide your bodies from prying eyes
And confuse the hell out of them with all our little lies

We know your catching on so fast it is making us sick
You’ll not be happy will you? until we are on a bbq spit

With that we hungry hippos bid you a good night
You wont ever change a thing no matter how hard you fight.

signed: lil cox and friends.

cj
cj

╭┳━┳┳━━━━━╭┫╰╮┈┈┈…┏━╮╭━┓┈.╭━━━━╮
┃┃╭╯╰╮┈VA┈┃▎▃╰╮.┈┈┃┏┗┛┓┃╭┫AFGE┃
╯┣╯┈╭╯CASH╰╭╯╭▌┈┈╰┓▋▋┏╯╯╰━━━━╯
╱┃┈┈╰╮COW╮┈╰┳┻╯┈╭━┻╮╲┗━━━━╮╭╮┈
╱┃┏┳┳┻┻━┓┣┳┳╯╱╱.┈┃▎▎┃╲╲╲╲╲╲┣━╯┈
╱┃┃┃┃╱╱╱┃┃┃┃╱╱..┈.╰━┳┻▅╯╲╲╲╲┃┈┈┈
╱┗┛┗┛╱╱╱┗┛┗┛╱╱ ..┈┈┈╰━┳┓┏┳┓┏╯┈┈┈
…………………….. ┈┈┈┈┈┗┻┛┗┻┛┈┈┈┈

ANutterVet
ANutterVet

@cj – – – with your signature art work, I may have already missed you. Stay well. See ya later. – – – Nutter.

cj
cj

@Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve,@James Clement: Thanks fellas, just late night bordemm.

I started another poem sorta thing, that included all the commenters, but I couldn’t remember everyone’s names. I didn’t want anyone to be offended due to my memory problem. It started something like this.

Look at Shill-kin fly through the air so fast
namnibor must have shoved a rocket up his ass

The bulletproof glass in the waiting room, was shattered to smithereens
They never should have underestimated the strength of OLDMARINE

Dennis sent a tweezer and a magnifying glass by eight
So lil Cox could could whine and cry and then go masturbate

Etc etc etc.

James Clement
James Clement

@cj – – – Keep after it! That has some serious potential. Fomenting the seed of an idea now that will require a few weeks . . .

Will e-mail you when I have it (do not expect within a week) and if you like it – – – then use as applicable. Pretty busy here. Lots of letters to answer, research to do, etc.

Will remain in touch.

Disgruntled Veteran
1973 – 1976 USMC
1978 – 1993 USN

Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve
Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve

Great Job right on the money

James Clement
James Clement

@cj – – – Nice work!

ANutterVet
ANutterVet

A Meeting State of Idealism . . .

Opening (by animation) the VA’s Top Executive’s Doors to get at their brains and mind-sets, where thought and reasoning occur, is the objective of this meeting.

Participants include Top VA Leadership, Attorney Ben Krause (JD) – Veteran Activist, and both Veteran and VA Visionary, and any other Support Staff that is designated by Mr. Krause, then both legal representation and idealists for VA and Veterans, not limited to Veterans Advocating Leaders, and Any Other Group Leaders for Veterans, and that Veterans should have whatever medical advice, and or any pharmaceutical services that the Veteran states that it gives the most relief and reduces discomfort by medicinal therapeutic treatments, so that the Veteran is are able to reach and obtain a normal lifestyle suited more to benefit the Veteran’s side more than the VA’s side when settling areas of managing.

And that any Federal Government Agency Officials or Offices of Legal Representation or Leadership will be encouraged to join-in, with the promoting of extreme Support for All Parties that are participating, and the authorized partnering with Government Intellectuals as needed by VA, Veterans, and the groups, that represents any parties that are present in this meeting.

This is going to be overlooked by For-Profit-Group of Business Behaviorists and Party Affiliated Political Marketing Managers, and the Top Decision Makers that make up the Executive Officers of the Veterans Administration, plus any Veteran’s Advocacy’s Groups that are deemed necessary to represent and litigate for the best interests of Veterans.

This meeting, if accomplished, should happen in an orderly manner. What’s so hard bout this? There should not be any disagreement on what stands for orderly. Any comment? – – – Nutter

ANutterVet
ANutterVet

Another Thing – Nothing is ever going to be resolved, if we don’t agree to have all parties sitting down together to discuss the best interests of Veteran(s), then this would be a good thing.

T
T

I have tried to herd cats most of my life…. impossible. lol That includes veterans and so-called patriots.

It would be nice but such things as integrity, some sacrifice that may hurt things too close to home and hurt the wallet or a job maybe is out of the question today. Not talking about military or engagement style sacrifice either. The kind that is really good for ALL in a community and for the nation’s best interest. Rather than what is best for foreigners or special interest groups to the corrupt that fills our government and agencies. Oh, and colleges.

Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve
Flotmorton P. Gildersleeve

The idea is to co-ordinate all the organizations that have their own agendas

ANutterVet
ANutterVet

Hello, by way of chance, is anyone still up on this early morning?

wpDiscuz