Veterans' Health Records

Department Of Energy To Analyze Valuable Veterans’ Health Records?

Veterans' Health Records

Veterans Affairs just announced a partnership with Department of Energy (DOE) using artificial intelligence and big-data solutions to analyze veterans’ health records.

VA is rolling out the new partnership, called the VA-DOE Big Data Science Initiative, to cull through mountains of data points using artificial intelligence and supercomputing resources only available at DOE and not VA.

The VA press release highlights VA’s “unparalleled health data trend information” only available through the agencies cataloging of 24 million veterans’ health records. The initiative also stands to make use of genomic data from the Million Veteran Program (MVP).

Are Veterans’ Health Records Databases Worth Big Bucks?

Ever wonder how valuable our health data is in the hands of private industry? Is VA charging a licensing fee for access to it? If not, why not?

For all my computer vets out there, what do you think of this move? What do you suppose can be done with all the data? And, is VA capable of keeping our private identifiable information private?

Here is the full VA press release:

VA partners with Department of Energy on big-data initiative to improve health care for Veterans

WASHINGTON — Today the Department of Veterans Affairs (VA) and the Department of Energy (DOE) announced the formation of a new partnership focused on the secure analysis of large digital health and genomic data, or so-called “big data,” from the VA and other federal sources to help advance health care for Veterans and others in areas such as suicide prevention, cancer and heart disease, while also driving DOE’s next-generation supercomputing designs.

Known as the VA-DOE Big Data Science Initiative, the partnership will be based within DOE’s National Laboratory system, one of the world’s top resources for supercomputing. The effort will leverage the latest DOE expertise and technologies in big data, artificial intelligence and high-performance computing to identify trends that will support the development of new treatments and preventive strategies.

“VA has developed unparalleled health data trend information from some 24 million Veterans who have used VA for health care over the past two decades,” said VA Secretary Dr. David J. Shulkin. “We are partnering with DOE to use their high-performance computing capabilities to allow thousands of researchers access to this unprecedented data resource over time in a secure environment. The transformative science that will be developed through this partnership will improve health care for Veterans and all Americans.”  

DOE high-performance computing represents the state of the art in global computer science, involving machines capable of millions of billions of calculations per second.

VA takes privacy seriously and has ensured all reasonable safeguards are in place to protect the records at the DOE National Laboratory.

“Driving innovation through our national laboratories in ways that can improve Veterans’ health care is a remarkable opportunity,” said DOE Secretary Rick Perry. “I look forward to working together to shape this VA-DOE partnership.”

One part of the new initiative is MVP-CHAMPION— short for the Million Veteran Program (MVP) Computational Health Analytics for Medical Precision to Improve Outcomes Now. MVP, VA’s landmark genomics program, has already enrolled more than 560,000 Veteran volunteers, who have provided DNA samples; completed surveys about their health, lifestyle and military experiences; and granted secure access to their electronic health records for research purposes. The partnership with DoE will maximize the impact of studies using MVP data.

Along with data from MVP and VA’s electronic health records system, the new VA-DOE program will use health data from the Department of Defense, Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services, and the Center for Disease Control’s National Death Index. 

An initial suite of specific studies that are part of VA-DOE Big Data Science Initiative is already being planned. One aims to build algorithms to generate highly tailored personalized risk scores for suicide. The scores could be used by VA clinicians and researchers to help predict which patients are at the highest risk, and to evaluate prevention strategies. The researchers will work with VA’s Office of Suicide Prevention to enhance current algorithms already in use in VA.

Another project focused on prostate cancer will seek new ways to tell which tumors are lethal versus nonlethal cancer and require treatment, and, by contrast, others that are slow growing and unlikely to cause any symptoms. Yet another study will explore what sets of risk factors are the best predictors of certain forms of cardiovascular disease to inform individualized therapy and treatments for patients based on their individual risk factors.

For more information on MVP, informatics and VA research in general, visit


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  1. Get ready for the VA Moogle, Woogle, Who-ogle, Genoogle, Big Business Ahoogle…Veteran’s Administration side-business that will be profit making. VA Department of Science & Exploration.

    Why is the DOE handling this and not the EPA? One answer, non-carrot crunching NASA and genetic warfare.

    1. Because DOE already has the capabilities and experience doing this, why reinvent the wheel when the DOE have been doing this for some time. Using statistics to find cause and affects have been around along time, Data Analysis is just a newer version of using statistics to finding trends and analyzing these trends in order to better usethem in models whether you use them for trading (Technical Analysis of Stocks), Ratio Analysis, and Fundamental Analysis of the same. Demand Planning. These are also used quite often in medicine when studying to find cures for disease or treatments-statistical analysis which is really what data analysis really is, is fairly universal. It is liken using words to describe things except these words are numbers used in studies. Linda, think of what DOE does-it is just taking the capability or strength of one federal government agency to be used by another-what would be the cost to reinvent the wheel when the wheel already exists?

      1. Who gave permission for VA to give our medical information to anyone else?

        Find cure for disease? Are you kidding me? They don’t find cure for anything. When someone finds a cure or a good treatment, they’re shut down immediately. Look at cannabis, for example, it cures just about everything but if you tell the VA you use it, like for pain, they call you drug abuser and stop everything until you get drug abuse counseling. They don’t want cures or treatments. They won’t even use the cures and treatments known to mankind for centuries.

        These guys, all these alphabets, are running the big con on all the vets. And everyone else. Time to wake up because they are compromising our medical info without authorization.

      2. “Find cure for disease? Are you kidding me? They don’t find cure for anything.”
        Read what I actually write, don’t read into what I write. I said people have used data Analysis in the past-not the VA. I have no clue why the VA is doing this. I am saying do not judge it because they are taking someone else’s strength, I just happen to know about Data Anaylis.

      3. nobody is about curing any disease.
        not va.
        not humana.
        not merck.
        not nobody.

        they have cures they won’t use.
        they have good treatments they won’t use.
        those issues need to be addressed before any further conversation as i see it.

    2. Regression Analysis-look it up. That is just one very basic way to go understand it.

  2. I don’t have a problem with this. In the end it is a study of statistics along the lines of regression analysis (for example) to find trends for cause and analysis-to be able to do it without adding the cost in reinventing the wheel within the VA since DOE does this anyways-probably does it very well. Law of large numbers…allows to spot trends and enables to make better decision and do so much more than what they can do now for us. Trust…but verify.

  3. On Topic, how does a lonely Veteran get heard. The post by? , sorry I forgot name, mentioned Veterans without on line access. I have several Vietnam Veterans living around me that just won’t go to the VA nor do they care. I have to believe there are many. They’re difficult to talk with. Still none of them will talk war stories. I get that. I guess my point is: The VA cannot help Veterans. They don’t want to. The Dr. shortage is blatantly undermining the law. Nothing is being done right now for Veterans and their health nor their benefits. How can anyone believe the VA is Veteran Friendly. Everything the VA is trying to accomplish is anti Veteran/pro VA thieves. More ways to get money/no ways helping Veterans. Will I get a Department of Energy badge? How do we stop this anti Veteran, illegal, and beating we keep taking?

  4. @ANutterVet, you’ve received some good advice. Live to fight another day. You are very much needed by the Veterans you help directly, and those Veterans who will never know. I’m going to speak my mind on this site. I may be right, or wrong. Doesn’t matter. I’m actually too old to carry out any threats I may or may not have made. Really didn’t need that last sentence, kinda a cya thing. @Seymour, I went to site and saw my post. Thing is, I don’t give a damn. This site is more important than any thing “they” do. Keep up with the truth. Looks like we could be losing free speech in America. So use it while we can. All of y’all are doing the only thing I know to do. Don’t worry about being right. Screw ’em.

    1. @Jo3n – Please list the sites where your comments were posted. Don’t worry, I have this in prospective. I have a fortunate habit of bouncing around in learning different types of topics. Things are under control on my end. Although, some people do things of the unexpected when they are targeted in one form or another. We shouldn’t underestimate people when they are playing kiddie games.

      @Seymore Klearly , @91Veteran – Please keep me posted on any findings, locations, or other pertinent information.

      @Ex va – I hope that your appointment went well yesterday. You may be having a slight cooler weather change coming your way. Stay painless as possible. Weekend is supposed to get cooler, but concerned about lower temps in early morning, dampness, and keeping my muscles relaxed [spasms].

      @-.-. .— = Any news on the scripting changes? I’m fine. These stuffs aren’t going to my head. Like anyone else, I’m concerned. Keep me updated. Thx.

  5. @ Ex va, glad you got home safely, that was a long trip. Will catch up with you later. Have chores to get done. That cj is one lazy bum…

    1. @-.-. .—, thanks for the welcome back. Don’t be so hard on cj he is one of the good guys. LOL!

  6. REPOST – **Important to All** – The post in which Seymore Klearly is referring to is mine. Now my suspicions are running all over the place. Why? My system crashed twice, and now someone has copied and posted one of my comments from Ben’s blog to at least three [3] websites.

    Any advice, please post. I’m very concerned about what to do about this matter, or if I should be concerned at all. This stuff is all new to me.

    If anyone knows how to correlate domain website names, using website analytic tools, to hopefully find any similar information, please help and post your findings. I’m not going any farther than to see the sites on the search page of Google. If you visit these websites, please don’t click on any hyperlinks until someone gives the go ahead or to stay away. The website domain names are as follows;


    This is one of the reasons that I was hesitant in following and posting comments on forums and blogs in the first place. Looks like there was something to my suspicions [?]. I’ve unsubscribed from all newsletters and other types of online communicating websites.

    I’d like to know if there is a VA Employee that is causing all this trouble. Or, that there may be someone that is disgruntled about something or someone?

    I’ve reviewed many past posts, and I’ve found some things that seem intriguing. One thing that I noticed, is that [at]Peterson is not a familiar commenter, at least to me. Thanks for helping out in this matter. Stay safe while online. Ben has been informed. Reposted by ANutterVet – May 3, 2017, 1:56pm [my systems time]

    1. So, Nutter, you must have said something useful to the Russian “Botware” used in the election. Don’t worry. It won’t affect my vote.


    2. @ANutterVet: Nutter, Seymore, says above, this crap is linked directly to the VA. Do not click on any links. Best you can do, is get your system up and running, update your antivirus, and don’t let it rent any more space in your head. I am sure capable people, are working, to get to the bottom of it. You let this shit define who you are, then they accomplished their goals..

      1. @-.-. .— I know, it seems like this shit is super sticky. Watch this link, the lead person with the mic [mike]. I’ve been mimicking his stage behavior for the past week. This is why I’m exhausted. And, I’m so desperate that I’m going to call the VA to come and pick me up. No one else wants to get close to the vicinity of my head or my reverberating body vibes.


    3. @ANutterVet, let Ben and others find out who this individual/individuals are at these sites who are trying to cause you, i and other bloggers on this site problems. Give the others time to figure out exactly what is going on. I know i don’t like this and felt it was somehow directed towards me as well. Sorry this is happening and i don’t blame you. I believe it is the va as Seymore has said as well as others who are blaming the va for this harassment.

    4. In checking those 3 web sites, the first one is registered in West Java, and the other 2 are registered in Panama.

      The 2 in Panama pay for a service to protect the names of the registrars or domain owners from a whois lookup.

      They could be bad sites, or they could be simple sites using bots to crawl other sites to copy content.

      There have been strange comments posted on this site over the past month that suggest someone is trying to trick Ben into providing more detail on his site to help them hack it.

      Without looking further, I am guessing all 3 sites are hacker sites copying content from other sites to look legitimate.

  7. @91Vet, the patient advocate did submit some kind of paperwork to administration. He was reading me from administration reply about Dr. being well vetted.

    1. Thanks for the follow up Jo3n, it is good to hear something was submitted, and they replied.

      Creating a paper trail like this may help some future vet abused by that quack.

  8. I did request another Dr., but there are only two, and the other isn’t going to do anything but send me to Birmingham VA. I honestly cannot get there. I did talk to local police. The sergeant smiled and said that they won’t touch it. I’m ok with not going to the VA, they really don’t have a decent cardiologist anyway. Again, thanks. God Bless the Veterans and their families.

  9. @Seymour, ANutterVet, and others, on my situation with Donald Doc. Without letting me know until an hour ago, they did attempt to make me an appt. For a cardiologist. When the clinic Nurse called, she said I come back in. I’m seeing a cardiologist tomorrow, (Medicare) According to the patient advocate, who was recording, Dr. Newland was well vetted by the VA. Last thing… The clinic staff said, ” incident never occurred.” I don’t know if that’s ok or not. Thanks again for everything y’all do. It’s a choice alright, if I have to keep going to local VA, well, I am beyond the, “kinda doctor “, with heart surgeries, stroke, I cannot bring myself to any VA. It’s a death sentence for me. Appreciate the concern.. the VA scares the hell outa me.

    1. Jo3n, thanks for the update on that.

      From what I can tell from your comment, you made a complaint through the patient advocate, they investigated and the clinic staff claimed it never occured.

      Not surprised.

      I highly doubt the patient advocate submitted a Report of Contact on your complaint. That would have generated a paper trail.

      If you did not, I still would request the VA police do a report of an assault. Even if they claim nothing happened, it should still generate a paper trail in case that quack wants to get tough with others.

      Did you tell the patient advocate you wanted to be reassigned to another doctor?

      Vets should not have to give up any rights when going to the VA, and have a right to be treated safely and humanely.

  10. If you signed up for the Million Veterans Program – guess what? You just released your medical records for research. And, that’s no bullshit. Also, if you actually read anything you signed at the VA you will see that you gave them all kinds of permission that you don’t even realize yet. READ IT NEXT TIME BEFORE YOU SIGN.

    The only bullshit is all the naïve veterans that actually trust the VA, VA doctors and VA nurses and VA employees. Apparently, there are millions of you. Thanks a lot. Keep on trusting them right into the grave. If we all stood up against them, they wouldn’t be able to do this crap, but no …. millions of you trust them and sign anything put in front of you. They need to change that million veterans program to a million idiots.

    1. @Sandy Hale, i understand your frustration with the va and trust issues with that agency. i do not trust the va in any capacity. i learned this from experience unfortunately and i warn others when they give me the opportunity.

      I do not blame the Veterans for trusting the va because they may not have the knowledge or experience with va’s corruption. I knew some Veterans who were illiterate and had no computer knowledge. These were older Veterans, how can you blame them, they grew in a different time period were there government was different.

      I know some disabled Veterans who have trouble reading and would of signed anything because of their disabilities. I feel the va takes advantage of these individuals. We have to get the word out of the va’s misconduct and corruption so the Veteran is more informed on decisions they make when dealing with this agency.

  11. Here’s two articles from “ News”

    “VA Sites Fixes at DC Hospital Ahead of Veterans Town Hall”

    dated: 2 May 2017
    “” | by Richard Sisk

    “VA Fires Embattled Louisiana Director Amid Scandal”

    dated; 2 May 2017
    “Fox News | by Tom Richards

    In my opinion, although each VHA was complicit in screwing veterans over poor quality healthcare. Each director, although guilty of these criminal acts against veterans, should be arrested for “Misappropriation of Government Funds!”
    The director of the Louisiana VHA was definitely more concerned with “…purchasing furniture and flat screen TVs for the conference room…” than he was in giving proper and quality healthcare to veterans!
    This, in itself, is not only egregious in nature, it is – I believe – “criminal in nature!”

    1. @Crazy elf- I wonder how the D.C. VA was able to acquire all those *missing* expensive medical machines, vast amounts of sterile surgical supplies, and tools, et al so quickly, and *fix* 100+ VAOIG infractions? A stroke of a hand, am sure was all that involved, or a group circle jerk with same motion. *FIXED*

      R-r-r-ight! That D.C. VAMC and VHA and VSO’s are nothing but a horse and pony show for Save Our System, VSO’s Inc. Come on in, it’s all safe now. We’re watching and recording, but we care at the VA.

    2. @Crazy elf:@#2. My fucked up mind first read that as (Director A’mid Scan’del) I thought (what kind of screwed up Indian/French name is that?) My bad.

      1. -.-. .—, ROFL!! Maybe his name tells on himself!! LOL!!! That is great!!! That is so funny!! I have a juvenile mind at times, doesn’t take much.

  12. Project Owl is Google’s internal name for its endeavor to fight back on problematic searches. The owl name was picked for no specific reason, Google said. However, the idea of an owl as a symbol for wisdom is appropriate. Google’s effort seeks to bring some wisdom back into areas where it is sorely needed.

    Right, wisdom. From a vendor of content wrapped in pay to play advertising and “black box” algorithms which mysteriously have magical powers on sites like Foundem

  13. For anyone who notice my earlier post regarding a campaign against this site and a number of us commenters. Where our names are being used as keywords to lead to probable infected sites.

    The articles start with the header of

    “@Namnibor, @Ex va, @Crazy elf, @cj, @Dennis, @Seymore Klearly, @91Veteran, @Peterson, @Jo3n”

    It is a smear campaign to attack the Search Engine Listings of this site. The campaign is coming directly out of the Veterans Administration. I will be forwarding a email latter today that I am going to ask Ben to pass on which will provide more information to those who have been targeted by the VA in this smear campaign.

    For anyone interested you can Google the title “VA Spent Billions Without Denting Doctor Hiring Problem”.
    Be sure to include the quotes. While the majority of the listing may be legitimate you can scroll through the Google search results and see there are a large number of sites that are bogus and still listed in the results. I highly recommend you do not click on the search listings at this time.

    1. lolz! I went public with my own personal historical garbage of a past in order to expose the VA for the liars they are and the treachery that they engaged in. Two full Sunday editions, Section F of bullshit which netted the VA multiple “technical” advisories from HHS regarding the Privacy Act of 1974 and landed specific names and dates in the headlines was the prize.

      Hehe, I did that because they ALREADY smeared my name across multiple agency records, across multiple federal agencies. They even went of their way to inform my local hospital during emegency surgery AT my local hospital to stop internal bleeding and save my lung, my leg, and my life), that I was a Catagory One Violent and Disruptive Patient… to their credit, both of the surgeons at that saved my life each confided individually to me their advice that I go to the police with what they saw in my record (and I did).

      So, thank you for the advice and trust me I believe you whole heartedly and for the evidence just mentioned, that VA is engaged in a smear campaign against me. It is in the record.

      Semper Fi

    2. Thanks Seymore,
      So, VA is trying to “smear” us over “comments” we’ve made here on “disableveterans”!
      I guess they “can’t handle the truth” when we post comments containing articles from other respected news sources. Or, we give “opinions” over what’s really going on at VA’s nationwide!
      I guess the VA is unaware of our “1st Amendment Rights” over FREE SPEECH!
      Of course, VA will try anything they can to shutdown all FREE SPEECH, in an attempt to silence TRUTH!
      We, on here, know there is a heavy push by the RADICAL LEFT to silence anyone who has opposing views. This can be seen at many (liberal run) Universities! The VA is embedded within these universities for using veterans as guinea pigs, ex: “BREAKING: Hospital Evacuated! Hazmat Situation!”
      Dated 1 May 2017
      Concerning a VA hospital was evacuated last night at around 5 pm in Philadelphia due to a suspicious odor!

      Why would we not expect anything like this from VA?

      1. P.S.
        Seymore, are there any other “vetcentric sites” VA is attacking over this issue of FREE SPEECH?

      2. Ethical Hacking, the VA way. “Ethical Hacking” is a very real thing and quite often happens right under/amongst regular posters and a name might be hijacked to post or not…

        I used to know an Indy Vet that the Indy VA actually sent him to an Ethical Hacking course for credits…then employed him part time in the basement as piss-bucket boy for whomever was too engorged to leave their desk for a hanky. I no longer trusted him and had a falling-out over what I saw as a huge red flag and hypocrisy so have fallen out for over a year. I very well could have taken it too extreme but if it was enough to raise the hair on my back, best leave well alone.

      3. This also now explains, the odd looks I have been receiving, from those behind the counter at the VA. Even had one nudge the other, to look at the computer screen, when they brought up my name. All started when I posted comments here, about an​ appointment I just got back from.

    3. @Seymore Klearly: I will look at this fuckery as a badge of honor. I will check it out, when I can copy and paste on a real computer. Haven’t figured it out yet, on this tablet. My damn middle finger locks in the closed position. Only thing I can think of, it must be from using this tablet. Older we get, the stranger the crap that happens to our bodies. <—————– Does that last sentence even make sense?

    4. @Seymore Klearly, this makes me angry trying to smear us and the search engine of Ben’s site. The va is abusing their authority again.

      1. What this also tells me is, if the VA is using our handle, to point to infected sites, then it is obvious, they already have captured our IP’s. Could it be this shit is just a ploy, to get us to click on our own comments, out of curiosity? Therefore infecting our computers, with their spyware? Heed Seymore’s warning, DO NOT CLICK ANY OF THOSE LINKS!!!!!!! Grrrrrrr I wish I had access to my ASCII art. Later gators!!!

      2. then it is obvious, they already have captured our IP’s…I THINK YOUR 100% right

      3. What this tells me is that the Russian Bots of fake news you guys keep posting has moved to a different level. Now they are trying to take down your computers. Either that or it is an NSA counter attack.

        I doubt the VA gives a shit about your fake news posts. And most of us have the good sense to know what is happening.

      4. @Lem: They may not give a shit about fake news, but I can tell you, they sure as hell give a shit, about what is being said about them here. We are taking about union hacks after all. I am sure that they don’t like “anything”, that jeopardizes their spot at the money teet. If you don’t think the AFGE/SES/SEIU, doesn’t have the connections, to pull this off, to cover their asses, then by all means, click away at the links. Fake news flash Lem, bitch Hillary lost all on her own. Both the aggregate vote, and the popular vote, the “Russians” had nothing to do with it. And you try to make it look like I’m the crazy fuck? Trump won over a fucking criminal, so the “Russians” must have done it. And 8 years of the biggest failure, to ever occupy the white house, is all Bush’s fault…righhhhht?
        Who’s the one that watches fake news?

      5. Yeh, who. You. You post the links. And now they are biting those who access them. Tough isn’t it.

      6. @Lem: Point to a link I posted to any news source, or shut the fuck up. Yeah that’s right, you can’t.

      7. So you were botted? Someone else posting under CJ? A lot of that went on during and shortly after the campaign.

        Wonder if someone used my name to post links to Utube and other sites? Easy to do on this site. We don’t have “accounts”.

  14. About 338,000 Tricare patients who have a Nexium prescription are being asked to switch to an alternative drug for their stomach and esophagus problems.

    As of June 28, Nexium will no longer be included on the Tricare preferred, or formulary, drug list, and it won’t be available in military hospitals and clinics.

    Defense health officials estimate that the change will save about $1.6 million a day in health care spending, said Kevin Dwyer, spokesman for the Defense Health Agency. That adds up to about $584 million a year……, HOW ABOUT JUST USING BAKING SODA DOES THE SAME THING..DUMB OLD MARINE

    1. and, why do so many people & animals have stomach problems to start with?

      maybe the food is contaminated? are euthanized pets in the food chain? yes.



  15. @Ex va: I hope your trip was without incident, and that your appointment went well. I imagine your exhausted from a very busy day. Not feeling well myself, I will be turning in for the night, early. Will talk soon, and God Bless you and your family.

  16. Off topic, but it looks like the American Legion is trying to get in on a publicity stunt with the DC VA problems.

    If they were serious about helping fix the VA, they would not have been running their Save Our System program for over 10 years.


  17. Most of us are missing something. I’m going nuts over the Giant Redwoods area being opened for mining. No hiring fed judges, didn’t think much about it, till what was safe in our country is now available for a dollar. As a Veteran, well, if truth be told, I just not sure yet. I am worried for all Veterans right now. SHIT is happening whether it’s for Veterans, or for them….so far, them 3, Veterans 1?@Seymour, you carry a heavy burden.., well.

  18. My first thought is, why DOE? Why this subject? I don’t recall reading many medical research journals suggesting the DOE has been any kind of leader in medical research.

    Is this the VA trying to do an end-run around Meshkin after they nixed his billion dollar data mining plan?

    My second thought is, who benefits from this? It sure as hell won’t be veterans.

    Do I think the DOE can keep our data safe? Well, likely more safe than Meshkin and his Russian connected buddies could, but then, we’ve all seen how safe government agencies can keep data safe. How many times has the VA leaked or lost veterans data? How many millions were affected by OPM’s data leak?

    I can’t really see the VA doing a massive transfer of a single database. I would have to think this would be some kind of ongoing, permanent connection to VA records.

    I could see DOE being interested in cancer research since they are so involved in nuclear energy. Are they interested simply because they want to see what health effects result from vets who have been exposed to radioactive material over the years? Has the DOE lost so much of their mission that they have to justify their supercomputers somehow? Or is this a way of justifying the expense of upgrading their systems?

    If you read Shulkins comments, do you get the sense he is trying to address some of the criticisms vets had with their deal with Meshkin such as access to data in a secure environment? Since the VA has this “unparalleled health data trend”, can Shulkin point to how knowing those trends has improved the health care of vets? As I asked when they were planning on giving exclusive access of this data to Meshkin, are they planning on charging a subscription fee to access this data? I can see them doing that to justify running this scheme, but will that fee be so high that they only get government funded researchers that can access the data?

    What health trends is the VA aware of in Agent Orange veterans that Tom Murphy denies exists?

    I find it interesting they state again that the VA takes privacy seriously, which means they are well aware of veterans criticizing their Meshkin deal, and also means they completely ignored any privacy problems when they were going to go with Meshkin.

    How can they go so quickly from offering Meshkin a deal just a few months ago, to suddenly having a deal with the DOE? Are there some very interested parties pushing this idea that offered the DOE as a way to address the privacy concerns? Certainly somebody really wants this data.

    If the VA only has 560,000 volunteers to their MVP program, why are they always touting having health data on 24 million veterans? It sounds to me as if they plan on using the data on 24 million veterans regardless of whether we volunteer access to our data or not.

    Who else just can’t wait to receive their very own personalized risk score on suicide? Gee, can I put that on a plaque? WTF? Can I put that on a vanity license plate? That statement seems like it’s designed more to just look like the VA is doing something about the suicide rate, while doing nothing about it at all.

    Am I missing something on their prostate cancer paragraph? How would they know what is lethal versus nonlethal unless they observed how it progressed without treatment?

    1. @91Veteran, i agree with your statements and questions. This to me make no sense the va and the doe???? What unparalleled and research achievements have been made thus far with this data collected? Will anyone ever know? I think this is all misleading and i have no doubt that the genomic data is valuable, i do not believe it will benefit Veterans in any capacity because the va does not want to deliver above standard care to Veterans. Veterans unfortunately are just a tool as per normal va operations.

  19. Bayer created heroin to get people off morphine(?). Being the United States disallowed the sale of heroin, doesn’t mean Bayer quit the heroin business. Now, people who were cut off pain meds are turning to heroin. The heroin is being cut with ketamine. Very expensive cutter. Who can cut heroin with the expensive ketamine? Who would? I remember our government sprayed us, sprayed pot plants coming to us. Too many people dying for what? God Bless the Veterans and their families.

  20. I had to do a lot of blood tests during that MVP drive and I always said no thanks. I had to give blood once a week for what they were monitoring, and every time it was “Would you like to participate in the MVP?” as if the employees were told to hound the vets into in to doing it, just like the canned “thank you for your service” you hear like a recording. Anyhow I got pissed and said “” OK!!! Take the fu***** blood!!! Now for the love of god quit asking me!!!!” My reasoning back then was they’ll use it for something else, non VA. Since then it’s been FBI, DOE and who knows who else since then. I always wondered why they were so adamant about it till a vet got ticked off, but I guess I know now. I thought there were going to be updates about that, but once they got your blood, that was the last I heard about it till these VA has a great idea- programs like this start coming out….

    1. I can’t see how a simple blood test, even with DNA or genetic information is much useful to them without having full access to your medical history.

  21. It’s one thing to be hacked, it’s something else if we just give them the information. As I see it, once some corporation gets the information, it’s theirs to do with what they want. Again, how is this Veteran Friendly? And I agree, how come DOE has all that empty space? @Dennis, you are correct; when and where did VA get permission to join? I’m starting to think draining the swamp is getting rid of corporations obstacles.

  22. Even if we DID sign something like that, “JackO, (which we did’nt) we would have never known or understood the meaning or significance with no education, and no way of knowing at such a young age, what the repercussions and ramifications would be!! Every instance should require the express approval of any and all veterans who would or could be affected by the shared information, each veteran should have full and complete veto power with proof that his or her wishes were honored, and should be well compensated for his or her participation! We are not supposed to be a republic of communism! You want me to do YOUR work, fine! But expect to hand YOUR salary over to ME!

  23. Simple reply For Mr. Krause, Office of Personnel Management (OPM) Security Clearance Data Base Theft of 23 Million Americans most private and personal information listed on the Standard Form-86. When the government lost the entire National Security Clearance data base it compromised every American with a Security Clearance, former Security Clearance Holders and all of their Family members information. The SF-86 National Security Clearance application is 176 pages with a persons entire family history. No data base is ever going to be totally secure, history has proven it time and time again. All of the nations veteran health information has probably already been compromised, however we will not ever know for sure until the information is used in a Illegal way, it is a simple fact of life and WikiLeaks is a perfect example. This is from somebody who used to be in the security business in the military for 12 years.

  24. From: Joe Joe GUNNER
    That is total B.S.
    What if a VET is working for DOE right now and has PTSD and is seeing the VA Psychologist. Doe would then use that against the VEt and he would lose his job.
    As of now it is not required to put that information down on a QNSP report that is used to grant Security Clearances at is even stated in the QNSP Instructions on Section #21. direct quote from QNSP, “In the past seven (7) years….Answer “NO” if the counseling was for any of the following reasons and not court-ordered. ….strictly related to adjustments from service in a military combat environment.”
    I happen to know several Vets that work for one of DOE’s Plants and with the record sharing the VA would give up sensitive information that DOE does not have on these VETs.
    Fellow VETS we need to stop speculating and debating this Issue and TAKE ACTION NOW! My bet is on DOE too start going thru all the DATA and target all VETS that said NO on the QNSP forms!
    This needs to be nipped in the bud now!
    Joe Joe Gunner

  25. All veterans should read the story of Brian Callahan, Combat Vet/ TBI in the Boston Herald today, May 2.

    1. Just want to add the Boston Herald is doing a series on Veterans issues with VA Health Care. Ben’s article yesterday was about one of the articles in the series. Ben’s article is the one titled Boston VA still Failing Veterans.

  26. @Seymour, I was reached by patient advocate an hour ago. I am positive that we were being recorded and the advocate new it as well. I’m not going to say anything till I feel better about saying anything. I check in quite often. Somehow, let us non computer Veterans have an idea as to how honest we can be. I did get new post, and it allowed me to get here. God Bless

    1. Jo3n,

      One thing that I have learned through personal experience is always be honest and you ever feel uncomfortable saying something do not say it. As far as suffering from paranoia, is it paranoia when you know for certain that some is watching?

      Here is part of a article on the blog. You may recognize a few of the names including yours.

      “VA Spent Billions Without Denting Doctor Hiring Problem”,, April 12, 2017

      Quoted verbatim

      “@Namnibor, @Ex va, @Crazy elf, @cj, @Dennis, @Seymore Klearly, @91Veteran, @Peterson, @Jo3n – Hey folks. The media are dumb fucks. They know what is going on with the VA. The only thing that I know they missed, in the whole time providing news, is the prediction of the come kid, President Trump. There forecasting of a winner went straight out the window and the window was open waiting for it. Dump fucks controlled by the left and fucking helmets [dick heads- and I coined this term on this blog] suck ass with the Governor, Senator, Congressman, Mayors, and every other fucking social engineering liberal dirtbag in each state.”

      Their is a full article but I don’t know the safety of the site at this time and would recommend using the cashed version at the following link. At this time I do not recommend clicking on any of the links on the page. *** Remember do not click on any links even on the cashed versions. ***


      It is also published on a website called (insurancenews dot com) a link to the cashed version is at


      It is also published on a website called (specialupdate dot online) a link to the cashed version is at


      There are more but I am sure you understand now that it is not paranoia and people are actively working to infect our computers due to our comments made on this site.

      I think they really hate me because they have tied my name to some sites that surly have tripped some bells and whistles at the NSA.

      1. Not fully sure of what they hope to accomplish but I am researching more on the problem.

        Most likely it is the compliments of Flow Health and their Russian counter parts. Not the Russian Government but the Russian owners of Flow Health.

        Also, it is my belief that any conversation you have at the VA is recorded. Even in the Exam rooms. Also you can be certain that all phone calls are recorded.

      2. @Seymore Klearly, if we are targets and they wish to destroy our computers, how can any of this be lawful? We have freedom of speech despite what are opinions, politics and views on articles, life or whatever. I would like to know specifically who is behind this interference and i find this to be an insult to Disabled Veterans and Veterans. Do you think this is a form of retaliation for exposure of wrongdoings and criminal activity that is exposed in articles and from bloggers?

        About phone calls to a va medical center, i believe they know the number of calls made, how many unanswered calls made and that some calls are monitored. I believe it is a collaboration of staff concerning Veterans conversations and threats and disruptive behavior.

        I believe if you want to know how the vamc conduct there disruptive behavioral committee meetings you can ask for a medical center memorandum copy at the directors office. I believe this will tell you the members of the disruptive committee and how often they meet. I believe minutes are taken at every committee meeting. I believe this is all taxpayer funded and all these copies are free.

  27. I really don’t know why, but, I can’t reach here using Ben’s last post. Says it’s not available. Obviously, paranoia is affecting this site, somehow. I’m a bit paranoid anyway. Do we post what we learn and how we think? Or, ? @Seymour, I added up all them numbers…. kept me busy for a while. Not really. God Bless the Veterans and their families.

  28. >>For all my computer vets out there, what do you think of this move?

    don’t like it. would only like it if veterans had real legal rights to protect them, which we don’t when it comes to VA/VBA.

    >>What do you suppose can be done with all the data?

    since the veteran community has few legal protections dealing with VA/VBA, i submit a “nefarious factor” will be done under the hood regarding all that data.

    btw, most veterans who make use of VA/VBA have all had the experience of medical data/results manipulated to benefit VA/VBA. anyone ever try to have that expunged from your records? its like VA/VBA keeps two sets of digital books.

    so no, i don’t want the DOE to have my data. the veteran will be on the losing end, and some company or fed agency will make money off this with out our consent.

    >>And, is VA capable of keeping our private identifiable information private?

    no. though we veterans hear that when our civilian doctor has requested med info from VA often times they don’t get it due to hippa or some other privacy law. i often think that is just a see-thru band-aid because insurance companies seem to get some things that i find odd, thus there are work arounds entities can use to get our private data. those contracts veterans sign with VA for certain things, i doubt a good lawyer would allow their client to sign such things they way they read, but VA/VBA sees to it that veteran gets squat if they don’t sign it. and probably in the details is the sharing of data.

  29. It’s bullshit. I have a wee bit of history with the Dept of Energy – well, off an on exposure to R&D programs over the last 35 years, including serving as “An Independent Review PEER” to DoE’s wind R&D program. Observations.

    1). In the 90s, I succeeded in getting DOE and FAA to collaborate on aviation impacts, marking and lighting, and safety issues related to ever-larger wind turbines. It was a cluster fuck. The regulations against inter-departmental funds transfer are insane. So, guess who’s paying? Yup – the DoE is going to suck off the VA teet. I promise. Nothing happens at DoE without a bus load of beltway mortarforkers funneling money away from, and in-to …some one else’s pockets.

    2). Funny how the article did not mention which DoE lab would be involved? To my slightly dated knowledge, the genome sciences require pretty specific coding, and who gives a rats ass how big the fucking computer is. That’s a BS sell too. DOE is big on computational fluid dynamics, but the DoD DARPA boys would smoke whatever DoE has. Lawrence Livermore Labs (LLL), or Lawrence Berkeley (LBL) have some horsepower, but, again, where’s the genome pedigree?

    3). There’s a half dozen universities out there that could seamlessly dive into this project (thinking Stanford). So, why VA and DoE? C’mon boys and girls – think – this is an easy one if you have faith that a royal fucking will ensue…. C’mon… There ya go – keep the data inside big government so the shit they learn will forever stay silent. A university group of PhDs and grad students would leak OUR fucking realities to the public. Can’t have that, right? So, LBL and LLL, known keepers of all secrets nuclear has the infrastructure to run the data and keep it forever hidden.

    4). Did I mention money? DoE gets about $26 billion a year. About $22 B goes to nuclear. We haven’t built a new nuke (new technology) in decades. Nuclear ENERGY was an accidental by-product of a weapons program. Those mo-fos are so fully entrenched in government coffers that they continue to suck funds from the taxpayers and funnel it over to the D-O fucking D. Wait until Trump finds out DoE is funding CHINA’s Thorium nuke Molten Salt Reactor program. Ya – the nuke energy that will indeed be cheap and safe, and, it can burn up a shit load of the existing stockpile of nasty waste. Can’t have that – let the Chinee do it. WTF?

    5). Follow the money. It’s a program with awesome optics that needn’t succeed. I can see a half dozen beltway denizens who conceived the program, sold it, and are lined up to (my favorite) Moderate the Stakeholders. Fuck me to tears.

    Then again – maybe I’m just a cynical old fucking pessimist….. and it’s possible the goats at the VA will piss rainbows and shit little nuggets of gold.

    1. Good points Windguy. I think the VA is intent on selling their little nugget of gold.

  30. They are going to do it anyway, or not. Since Dr Shulkin has been in charge, I have heard a lot about the VA, and how great they are going to be. My personal VA experience doesn’t reflect all this gibberish I keep hearing. My situation is deteriorating with the VA. Is anything the VA is doing, helping Veterans? Sure appears to be all about the VA, and the same crap for the Veterans. I still have no idea what’s going on with any of my situations. I know what the VA is trying to do now with DOE will hurt Veterans, although the VA will be ok. Because, VA isn’t human, it’s a title.

  31. Here’s a scenario I want an opinion on.
    First, This new thing VA wants to couple with the DOE over. How much of taxpayers monies will it cost?
    Secondly, The new budget of $1 TRILLION DOLLARS was just passed yesterday, allegedly, to keep the government going until September 31, 2017. The end of the 2016-2017 fiscal year!
    Third – How many want to bet the VA will be back in front of Congress, asking for MORE taxpayers monies before 1 September 2017?!?!?!

    1. @Crazy elf

      Fourth – who the hell granted Constituional Authority for one cabinet to join resources with another for Gods Sake! Who the hell decided that the core idea within our Constituion of separation of powers was no longer the firewall we needed against tyrany?

      (hint: it wasn’t Thomas Jefferson)

  32. 44 61 77 6e 2f 54 6f 6e 79 2f 4c 69 6c 79 2f 4a 61 63 6b 4f 20 0d 0a 0d 0a 41 6c 6c 20 74 68 65 20 73 61 6d 65 20 74 72 6f 6c 6c 21 21 21

    1. Seymore ,

      I wish I could see more clearly the meaning of your numbers…

  33. I think no good will come of this. I believe that veterans personal information will be compromised. As to the actual records themselves, they are already garbage because garbage is input every time we use the VA. Examples of this garbage are questions like: Do you feel safe in you home, Do you feel depressed, and all the other form filling questions that the VA employee fills in on each of our appointments. Most of the time the veteran never knew these questions were asked until they get a copy of their medical records. I don’t know about others but I review my medical records closely, because first I want to try to eliminate or correct any entry that is not correct ( which is almost impossible). Next, if I see something in the record about do I feel safe, I will confront the nurse that filled out the questions and request them to stop writing lies. How do you do this you may ask? simple, use the official email at healthevet, every message you send using the VA mail system to contact your “medical team ” is required to be inserted into your medical records. If you challenge the entries often enough, most lies will stop. Finally, for many of us, our medical records are what support out compensation. If the medical records are screwed up with false information, that bad information could have an effect on our compensation. For example when I injured my left knee, I was asked how I injured the knee. My answer was my right knee buckled causing me to fall to the ground and in the process I twisted my left knee as I fell. ( from day one this is how I described the cause of the injury). Most providers ignore the story and said veteran fell on knee. Now when I apply for compensation based on a secondary condition, ie bad right knee buckled and caused me to fall twisting the left knee and tearing the meniscus, the raters is going to say he fell on his knee so he is not entitled to secondary service connection, so people make sure the whole story is entered into the record. I challenged two va employees because they entered false information concerning my knee injury. Most important, and I learned this the hard way, Only tell the va employee what is necessary nothing more, don’t elaborate, don’t tell stories, don’t say someone told me that … because everything you say ends up in that medical record.For example, I am overweight, I have been for 12 years, and I have tried to exercise but because of my COPD, bad knees, bad back etc ( fill in any excuse) I have not been able to lose the weight. When that examiner ask you are you exercising, be careful what you say. If you say yes I am walking on a treadmill or running they will enter your remarks. Now you file a claim for additional compensation because your knees are killing you… the c/p examiner notes you are exercising on a treadmill, and you told the prior examiner you are doing fine… so that c/p examiner is going to go with what the record says, not what you tell him at the time, and there goes that increase. Yes the records are full of garbage, but some of that garbage is our fault because of what we say to a VA employee, the rest of the garbage is the fill in the blanks that we never know were filled in, and every visit we make there is a different fill in the blanks entry into our record. Each time we go to the va, what do they do , weigh us, take vitals, and then ask us about our medications. Be careful talking about meds….. and remember they have a printout of all the prescribed meds, if you say your not taking something that could hurt you on c/p at a later time. Also, if your retired military, be careful what you say to the military doctors if you use a military hospital because the VA and the services are sharing medical information, right now its mainly medications, but in the future it will be the whole record… So like I say our med records are already garbage, and that garbage will get passed on to some yawho’s at the DOE, they ( the DOE) will input the garbage, and all their own garbage at the same time, and then when research is done they cite the medical records of hundreds of thousands of veterans as fact… The system is screwed up…. if the va has the authority to share our medical records with the DOE, who else are they sharing them with… I don’t like this at all…

    1. Depends on the “program.” My bank account is disconnected from the bank on its reports. When they search for my overdraft it will eventually come back to my account and notify me.

      When I pay an online purchase with my credit card it goes through a separate program which pays the supplier. The supplier only gets my shipping information not my CC number.

      These separations protect me and enable me to do my online banking and online purchases. Yes, they can be bridged by hackers but it is very difficult. And my bank and CC info is much more profitable to a hacker than my Health Care file which has nothing I’m unwilling to share if it will make you live longer. Some things in it I do from my own research like taking a dash of cinnamon in a morning cup of coffee to boost my immune system and stimulate insulin production. But that is not my personal invention. It is knowledge that has been in India for millennia.

    2. Rick B, I do the same when trying to address a medical record error. I send them a secure message. I also take screen shots of the message sent, and any replies, then email them to myself on my own personal account, just in case my secure messaging suddenly disappears.

      In the case of my records being falsified, I sent a detailed letter describing every line of the record that was false to the Privacy Officer asking them to correct the record. That letter went to the Chief of Staff, who investigated the provider. The provider responded in writing, and they corrected the record.

      I was told in the last instance of incorrect information being entered that it was a mistake she made in selecting one of the canned answers, and that she talked with the IT department about changing it, but she was told it was impossible because the record was locked. I got screen shots of those messages.

  34. Does anyone else note how truly amazing it is that the DOE computers can accept the database containing all Veterans Health records and even the dysfunctional Russian owned and operated Flow Health had computer access that could the database.

    But the VA and Department of Defense could not share the database or for that matter the VAs computers were not interoperable between VAMCs in different regions. Even though each year the VA has been spending Billions to achieve the goal.

    1. Well, in one instance the VA can make millions. In the other, they may have to pay out millions.

      Pretty clear numbers to a corrupt bureaucrat.

  35. Off topic
    On a different thread I posted that I had finally gotten the VA to get me an appt with neuro…they fucking failed again and used the same tactics of Omission to tell me about only healthier portions of my back. When I asked the rest, the nerve roots, the shit bag ended the visit…now I’m supposed to go through PT and pain management. Again. Like the last 14yrs!! FUUUCK

    1. sounds like me LP i have a cyst on my spinal cord on my neck and tell me its nothing more than arthritis and never go by the older MRI’S that shows the problem. thats why if i sleep on my left side i get migraine headaches and my left arm goes numb…never want to send me to a neurologist. oh what great health care we get …

  36. Will only work on records of the last 20 years at the most. The older veterans still getting shit on as far as care. WWII veterans did O K for a while. While the country still remembered Pearl Harbor from personal memory not history books.

    The country doesn’t see any war since then as a threat to their livelihood and therefore those veterans don’t count.

    1. “Former Homeland Security Secretary Jeh Johnson snared in growing pursuit of personal email”, By Alex Swoyer – The Washington Times – Monday, May 1, 2017


      Former Homeland Security Secretary Jeh Johnson has dug through more than 26,000 emails from his personal account, trying to figure out which of those were government business that he should have turned over to the government as official records, the Justice Department told a federal court Monday.

      Three of Mr. Johnson’s top aides also used personal accounts to do their official work, the government has told the court — feeding the growing legal storm over secret email accounts and how much access the public should have to those records.

      Judicial Watch has sued to get a look at the messages from Mr. Johnson and his staffers.

    2. The majority of the population doesn’t even realize we’re at war now and have been since 2002. Several times in the last couple years, while in uniform I’ve been asked if I was a security guard a flight attendant and the bewildered, what are you?. The majority of GENPOP don’t even recognize their own country’s military uniform.

  37. Someday a book /documentary is going to be released regarding some new drug or medical
    breakthrough that resulted from this VA-DOE Big Data Science Initiative research by the many
    research scientists and scholars. Of course the veteran community will not be properly compensated.

    I am enclosing some more news articles and information readers of this blog might find useful. I am sure
    these articles are off topic–therefore I apologize.
    1) I think the case of Eric Loomis is important. He is in prison, he is a criminal (he is not a veteran) and he
    is a bad person– but what happened to him can happen to anyone. The US Supreme Court might be hearing his appeal:
    State of Wisconsin v Eric Loomis no. 2015 ap157-CR
    Decided: July 13, 2016. (Mr. Loomis was arrested in 2013)
    NY Times article: May 1, 2017– ” Sent to prison by a software program’s secret algorithms.”–by Adam Liptak. ( Also see reporter Mitch Smith’s article, also NY Times June 22, 2016–“Using Data to Foretell
    Defendant’s Future.”) This article is also about Mr. Loomis.
    I have another story, but first– there have been comments on this blog about Veterans Courts
    and their jurisdiction. I think using algorithms and big-data- forensic science to convict people or determine if a person should be released from an institution or a court of law should change people’s
    attitudes with regard to Veteran’s Courts and activity at all VA hospitals ( Disruptive Behavior Committees) We all should pay more attention to court cases if they involve Veteran’s Courts and Big Data.
    #2) A journalist named Rebecca Skloot wrote a book titled: The Immortal Life Of Henrietta Lacks.
    The story is about a black woman in Baltimore MD in the 1950’s and John Hopkins Hospital.
    Mrs. Lack’s story has to do with the pharmaceutical industry. Her cells ( produced from a biopsy)
    became known as HeLa cells. The Pharmaceutical industry made billions. Mrs. Lacks died impoverished- never knowing of her contribution. Her family continues to fight for compensation and justice.
    Thanks to for the expression of free speech and ideas like the many I read on this
    blog nearly everyday.

    God bless the veteran community.

  38. I JUST READ THIS ON HEALTH.MIL if you broke your arm, came down with pneumonia, or your child had a severe earache, you wouldn’t think twice about going to the doctor and getting treatment. Maintaining our health and receiving effective treatment for ourselves and our loved ones is a duty and responsibility. But what if the injury isn’t accompanied by physical pain, an x-ray finding, or an abnormal lab test? What is our duty and responsibility when it comes to good mental health?….. SO IF THE DOCTORS ARE INCOMPETENT OR LAZY AT THE VA YOU NEED GOOD MENTAL HEALTH OR AM I NOT COMPREHENDING THIS RIGHT

  39. Do y’all want to read a great, uplifting, article?
    This was published today, from “ News”
    dated: 1 May 2017

    “Horseman Rides Across US to Bring Attention to Agent Orange!”

    Associated Press | by John Rogers

    It’s going to take about two months to accomplish his task. I believe y’all will like this story!

  40. Let me quote my favorite American speech; “Citizenship In A Republic”. Before you read this let me tell you that the passage was spoken by an American President long ago, about a war long past and the warriors who fought it. This President was speaking directly about United States veterans. After you read this, ask yourself “Can any machine understand what these simple words mean? Could ANY machine ever describe a human being this way? Could any machine desribe a veteran so succinctly and clearly so as to bring tears to the eyes of grown men and women?”

    Can anything called articificial intelligence believe and act upon the conviction that every single United States veteran deserves the credit due, or believe that each and every individual veteran matters?

    In 1910 in Paris France Theodore Roosevelt spoke these words about American veterans, and not one godamn machine in the Universe can understand any of it – not one godamn machine, no matter how intelligent will ever weep over them, or over any United States vet;

    “It is not the critic who counts;
    not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles,
    or where the doer of deeds could have done them better.
    The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena,
    whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood;
    who strives valiantly; who errs,
    who comes short again and again,
    because there is no effort without error and shortcoming;
    but who does actually strive to do the deeds;
    who knows great enthusiasms,
    the great devotions;
    who spends himself in a worthy cause;
    who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement,
    and who at the worst,
    if he fails,
    at least fails while daring greatly,
    so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”

    1. “Teddy Roosevelt” knew more than people gave him credit for!
      He was a “Man for all men!”

  41. Last thought from an insider at ‘The Muppet Show’s Muppet Labs’:

    “What the Dept. Of Energy is getting in exchange for helping the VA is a very special codependent partnership of gov’t agencies. In the event of a USA based Chernobyl Meltdown event, able-bodies will be needed to go into the hot zone to procure sensitive corporate data left behind. This is where our brave Veterans will be utilized to procure this data.
    But just how would you get a Veteran to willfully walk into a zone that’s a guaranteed death sentence? This is where the VA will airdrop all Veteran’s medications yet to be mailed-out into the nuclear disaster hot zone and will tell Veterans IF they want their meds, they MUST go in, procure sensitive corporate dats, and if still alive go back and try to find their health records that caused the meltdown in first place.”

    D.O.E. Dept. Of Eradication + VHA Partnership, still Dept. Of Eradication.

    Why is the VA hellbent on making $$$ off our medical experimental records?

    1. Maybe the DOE needs to check the plutonium pellets the VA gave us during a lab visit or disguised in the VA’s Pharmacy Formulary?

      In A Mood.

      1. …or the health effects of millions of veterans exposed to DU in the Middle East.

  42. You all know that this crap does not fly and work with Social Security and Medicare selling USA citizen’s medical data to highest bidder because….the American Taxpayer has such strong advocates as AARP for one, and NAACP and others that would say a resounding….HELL NO!

    We Veterans are very low-hanging fruit because the VA KNOWS they have Veterans by the balls by our dependence on VA benefits and healthcare. The U.S. Gov’t. is ALLOWING this to take place, make no mistake about it.

    President Trump: How would you like your family to be medically experimented upon by idiots then that shitty falsified data sold to the highest bidder? (never mind any healthcare…it’s now redefined as VA Deathcare)

    How do make ourselves NOT low-hanging fruit for the VA? I did not read any OPT OUT option offered to we low-hangers down here.
    IBM Watson also could not have predicted my massive shit had a part 2….or did he?

  43. to help advance health care for Veterans and others in areas such as suicide prevention, cancer and heart disease, I CALL ALL THAT BULLSHIT. MORE DATA SO THEY CAN FIND MORE WAYS TO KILL YOU. AND YOUR RIGHT ELF WHICH IS IT 560,000 OR 24 MILLION …high-performance computing capabilities to allow thousands of researchers access to this unprecedented data resource over time in a secure environment..MORE DNA RESEARCH TO SEE IF THE GMO FOODS AND VACCINES ARE DOING WHAT THEY WERE INTENDED TO DO. THAT IS SLOWLY KILL US …. LIKE BILL GATES SAYS ON TED TALKS IF WE DO A REALLY GOOD JOB WITH VACCINES WE CAN REDUCE THE CARBON FOOTPRINT.. BUT WHO AM I TO KNOW ANYTHING I’M JUST A CONSPIRACY THEORIST ….I GUESS THEY WILL COME UP WITH A WAY FOR US TO USE LESS OXYGEN WITH ALL THAT DATA..LOL

  44. What’s next, a corporate crap monitor (CCM) on Veteran’s toilets to determine how toilet paper manufacturers should make future toilet paper based on Veteran’s eating habits?

    How about a corporate pillow monitor (CPM) on Veteran’s mattresses to determine how our lack of sleep because of PTSD affects the cushiness of particular pillows?

    How about a corporate bodybag monitor (CBM) on Veteran’s bodybags to determine just how many weeks can go by before said bodybag explodes in order to reduce labor time with more time left on shelves to explode and so the funeral service industry can profit on backs and bodies of Veterans?


    As long as Garbage In Garbage Out is programmed by the human HACKS at the VA, NONE of the data will EVER be ACURATE.
    Folks, we Veterans are still very much mere pawns for the VA to make $$$$ off of, never mind good healthcare, it’s not the goal with non-human test subjects.

    Greedy Rat Bastards. Non of us signed-up to be exploited later as it were!!!!!!!!!!!

    I bet IBM’s Watson could not have anticipated the large shit this has induced this morning….or have they?

    1. I can just see some VA hack asking the Dept. Of Energy folks, “So, what if we feed all Veterans Plutonium and see what happens when two Veterans come together. We fusion take place before the Veteran dies a horrible death? Can it be improved upon to make living tissue fusion possible?

      Yeah, the VA *anywhere near* nuclear crap could very well mean the end of mankind in the making.

      HELL NO!

  45. So, the VA which has been characterized by uncountable numbers of Americans as being out of control and capable and succesful at fucking up nearly everything they have been tasked to do, now seeks out a partnership to do so at computational speeds only capable of the enormous calculating potential of the supercomputers the governments uses to simulate conditions inside of a nuclear reaction while it is underway, irregardless of if the operation is for producing steam for generators or if the operation is a thermonuclear device detonated to vaporize humans.


    Let’s step back a bit. What is the mission of VA? I do not recall their mission had anything to do with propagating medical reaearch. It had something to do with helping vets, but somewhere along the line they did indeed branch out and grow their own set of mission parameters. Somewhere along the line they branched out and became an independent nation complete wih their own armed security, their own laws, their own Due Process, and an allegience owed by its own operatives that transcends our nations boundaries. Somewhere along the line we began to ignore the law that flatly states all VA employees must posess US citizenship. The law still states that but we ignore it on the preposterous notion that America with about a quarter billion citizens simply cannot find qualified humans encumbered by US national citizenship and pride to work the jobs needed to help veterans who have earned it. Somewhere along the line the VA became an entity all of its own and seemingly forever out of reach of The People, and is now staffed by a diverse workforce that is all inclusive of felons, foreign souls, unqualified doctors, slothful unions, liars, thieves, and beggars – AND all of them are empowered thusly on the grand ideal that our nation owes service to veterans of the United States military.

    Now our host Ben, posts information that VA now is spending our tax money for taxi rides across town to the Department of Energy to ogle at the immense supercomputers needed to calculate transitional phases of matter to energy conversion not altogether unlike what our most brilliant minds believe is going on inside of our own Sun. The VA, tasked with mending broken bones, broken spirits, and broken lives now says it needs the power of The Department of Energy to sift through the data they have gathered from veterans in return for the broken promises they have made.

    Tell me something;
    Do you prefer a real leg, or an artificial leg?
    Would you rather have a real hamburger or an artificial one?
    Do you prefer to walk among Mother Nature’s God given plants, or do you prefer to walk amidst artificial plastic ferns?
    When you bake do you prefer to use real sugar, or artificial?


    Would you rather that the VA fuck up at the speed of human thought, or would you rather that they hand that chore to artificial intelligence?

    Handing the VA the keys to the DOE supercomputers is a colossal circle jerk in the making, but beyond that, tell me one thing that the VA has EVER embarked upon that has EVER made anything better? ALL this does is further expand their sphere of influence ever deeper. Ben, what you write about is an agency that now is crossing its own borders and marking out its new territory. Think clearly about where this particular direction will lead us in ten years – BILLIONS funnelled into a massive effort to do what? Let something artificial begin to fulfill the promises made to veterans? Just look at the damn track record they haveworking with the DOD!!! The rat bastards cannot even get along with the military agency that supplies them the fresh meat? HOW THE HELL are they supposed to get along with the DOE folks when they can’t even manage to share records politely with DOD? DOE is staffed by extraordinarily bright human beings – can you imagine the culture shock when they are forced to mix with VA folks who are at the other end of the cognitive spectrum?

    Is it really such a grand idea to hand the keys to the Porsche over to the driver who can never seem to make it down the block on a moped without causing carnage? Maybe it is if you believe that the artificial promises they are making won’t be broken one more time.

    1. Good points Dennis. I prefer if the VA has to fuck things up, they do it at the speed of an old Commodore 64 with faulty RAM.

      Does this mean their fucks ups will look like mushroom clouds?

    2. Awesome retort. I believe you should print this and send it to every member of Congress. You know this isn’t even on their radar right now. But, with a few well placed/worded letters of inquiry you might get them talking about – yes, I’m having an optimist moment, forgive me. But, yes well opined!!

  46. What do I think? That’s easy, In one word = “SCAM!”

    The ‘data’ entered into the computer, has to be accurate! The VHA healthcare providers are widely known for entering false information!
    Since computers were first designed and built, false data has caused misinformation to be thrown back out.
    The old saying comes to mind; “Garbage in, Garbage out!”

    How many of the so-called “…enrolled more than 560,000 Veteran volunteers…”, are actually “volunteers”?
    Plus, the article claims around “…24 million…” veteran medical files have been accessed for this research to be done!
    So, is VA using 24 million veterans healthcare records, or is VA only using 560,000 veterans’ records for this “experiment”?

    Is this just another reason NOT to trust VA? Answer = “YES!”

    1. P.S.
      I’m not a “super computer whiz kid”! Every one on here knows that!

      It’s just my opinion, that *IF* VA is involved in this, its got to be a scam to rip off the American Taxpayer!
      The VA has been known, for decades, for NOT telling the truth! What makes this any different!!!!!!

      1. P.P.S.
        Here’s a thought.
        What if veterans could use this scam for our benefit?!
        Let me explain;
        All this information, being downloaded into a supercomputer has to be accurate information.
        We veterans know that is more likely than not going to be the case!
        So, if veterans are harmed by this scam, could veterans take legal action against:
        Dept. of Energy (DOE) *or*
        The VA *or* both agencies?

        Just a thought!

      2. I agree with Crazy elf: “Garbage in equals garbage out” when it comes to analyzing data. I’m a retired computer professional, and that is the first thing that was taught.

        VA staff take no pride about VA medical record accuracy, especially when it come to making secret (undiscused) entries concerning drug and alcohol use.

        Suicidal events are worse: VA staff just make up their own version of what the vet did and why, to suit VA’s needs. The more lethal the suicide attempt, the LESS likely you are to be given a high suicide risk flag.

      3. Crazy Elf, I believe the VA for years has thought they are sitting on a gold mine with this data, and are just trying to figure out how to sell it…without looking like their sole focus is money.

        I believe there will be exorbitant fees charged to access this data, with percentages to be split between the VA and whoever they convince to do this.

        Hell they can’t account for the budget they are given much less the millions that will be rolling in from this.

        I bet the best minds at DOE have their supercomputers running 24/7 trying to come up with the detailed formula needed to squeeze every cent they can out of this.

  47. GIGO is what you have using VA medical records for anything.

    What would help is if the VA employees learning ‘military, they think that being curt means we’re mad.

  48. Good Article, Ben.

    Dr. Meryl Nass, to my mind is one of the most morally honest researchers on the planet. As soon as I saw her name in Seymore Klearly’s comment, I was immediately reminded of the fine work she did along with Doctors Garth and Nancy Nicolson back in the ’90’s and early 2000’s. Research that has helped thousands of veterans who heeded what they had to say.

    I have shared in previous comments the story of my “personal” experience with them. I am still breathing today because of that experience.

    To paraphrase a great quote from the movie A Few Good Men: “The Government wants the truth? The Government can’t handle the truth!” And they sure do not think that we as individual citizen’s can.

    When did freedom become naught but illusion in this country? I’ll leave the bits and bytes to the IT gurus to debate and sort out.

    Our government wants to do right by this nations veterans who have so honorably served their country? Here is how to get it done:

    1. Expedite implementing the HOLMAN RULE.

    2. Recognize the problems inherent in the VA are SYSTEM-WIDE, not just limited to a few locations.

    3. Fire all the Lazy No Good Workers. Fire EVERY single AFGE/SES Employee.

    4. Sell off all the VA facilities. Alternatively, they may be converted into housing for homeless veterans.

    5. Issue all veterans a card that allows them to choose their own doctors within their community that they can TRUST.

    6. The United States Government will PAY those doctors promptly for the care they provide veterans.

    7. Completely ELIMINATE the “Federal Protection” Umbrella for incompetent QUACKS that the VA sends to other states to practice other than their own. Gonna practice in Hawaii? You need to be LICENSED in Hawaii. Same applies to all other states.

  49. Do we REALLY need ANOTHER BIG BROTHER collecting and archiveing data that we will probably never have access to?

    RE: VA takes privacy seriously and has ensured all reasonable safeguards are in place to protect the records at the DOE National Laboratory.

    Yea Right…heard that before…

    RE: “VA has developed unparalleled health data trend information from some 24 million Veterans who have used VA for health care over the past two decades,”

    If this is true why did it take 20+ years for the VA to admit AO was killing us and our families…
    And how long will it take for them to admit that burn pits are killing Iraq and Afghanistan Vets?

    1. @Donald Avant – – – I believe the VA when they say they ““VA has developed unparalleled health data trend information from some 24 million Veterans who have used VA for health care over the past two decades.”

      I just do not believe they have the slightest clue as how to use that data to benefit the veterans that VA is supposed to be serving.

    2. Hell the DOE can’t even keep their nuke secrets secret. Wasn’t it Los Alamos that had quite a scandal over some Chinese national downloading nuke secrets and taking them home?

  50. VHA is so far removed from true and honest medical fact finding initiatives due to falsifying electronic health records, it would be another waste of taxpayer dollars to hope for different results. The very definition of insanity. The only difference this go around would be the level of scapegoat, and of course its DOE classification. Will look into exploits to answer PII/PHI data exchange question at a later date, always a way into cybereverything.

  51. Don’t like it.

    It means the DOE will be maintaining separate research Medical records for every Veteran and the likely hood that we will ever be able to access those research files is null.

    They state “We are partnering with DOE to use their high-performance computing capabilities to allow thousands of researchers access to this unprecedented data resource over time in a secure environment.”

    I have recently seen some of the bogus research coming out of DOE’s National Laboratory system that is totally bogus and only published internally because it can not stand up to the scrutiny of the peer review system used by respectable journals.

    An example a internally published report from the DOE written in an attempt to discredit an anthrax vaccine researcher who has stood up for Military personal against the use of anthrax vaccines vaccinations. She has also provided expert testimony at trials in Canada and Israel that resulted in victories and compensation for Veterans in those counties who were given the Vaccine.

    One of the her most highly cited articles involves an anthrax outbreak in Zimbabwe during the war there in 1978-1979 where she show that the outbreak was a result of government forces using anthrax as a weapon.

    The Bogus report that attempts to discredit her was only published internally and can be found at:

    “Using Dempster-Shafer theory to assess explanations for the Zimbabwe anthrax outbreak of 1978-79”, S. P. Velsko, May 8, 2015

    In the report Velsko attempts to use a unproven junk science called “Dempster-Shafer theory” to discredit Dr. Meryl Nass’s prior research which was peer reviewed. The amazing thing about the junk science report Velsko claimed supported his conclusion. Each time he could manipulate the variables to claim he was correct. But several points where he could not manipulate the Variables and the theory supported Dr. Nass he then claimed the theory he was using was wrong in those instances.

    More Junk Science using research records created by using our medical records is all that is going to result from this. No doubt some one is going to make a lot of money selling out our medical records and Shulkin will be one of the people making money on it.

    1. Yes – I totally agree with this statement. Hopefully the current medical providers will continue the work using the information, not creating a false result like the DOE tends to do. Too much is at stake here to be making up false results. I’d really hope that the integrity of the researchers on behalf of the VA continue. There are some great studies done by the VA (or others using their information).

      1. *************That should read Bullshit “Dawn/JackO”*************

      2. “BULLSHIT JackO”
        I never signed anything which would allow VA to use my medical records in a way you just described!
        Go back to your rabbit hole!

      3. ABSOLUTE HORSESHIT! Out of the $200 million spent over 20 years by VA and DOD researchers on Gulf War Illnesses, can you point to a single one that produced a treatment for Gulf War vets? A diagnosis? A cause?

        Out of that $200 million, how many studies in the VA portfolio are duplicate studies by the same researchers taking turns at being the lead author, and peer reviewing themselves where their conclusions say all Gulf War ailments are caused by stress?

        Let me enlighten you. There is a reason why the Congressionally Directed Medical Research Program exists…even though the VA has tried their damnedest to stop it. It exists to fund independent, private medical researchers after congress agreed with Gulf War vets that VA researchers were pissing away millions of dollars on worthless research.

      4. I too cry “Bull Shit” cause no one has ever giving me a copy of any document I’ve sign on that desk-pad they have there for you to sign…. I’ve reminded them of the Federal Law(s) of the law about me/us being given a hard copy of what we are about too sign… Their reply, we’ll put a copy in your records, my thoughts’ are at the time, look dip-stick, if I’d wanted a copy in my records instead of my hands so that I may read what I am signing away right now. I won’t have bothered asking you in the first place…. And if they are using my medical records for anything other than wiping their rear-ends’ cause my stuff as been changed so many time’s but doctors from Northport, VHA, Brooklyn, Manhattan, Bronx, Fayetteville, Salisbury, all the way too Durham, after those tech’s found something on my lungs after that two week war, he instructed me too inform my PCP the very next time we meet….
        which I did and you know what that lying PCP stated, that the X-ray tech didn’t tell me that, and that was after this same fool deleted the techs’ report. Six month or a year later I was sent in for another chest X-ray, and the very same tech {whom he and I did time at Ft. Sam, combat medic war college summer of 85.} anyway he looked up his last report on me and sure enough it wasn’t there in the system anymore. “So he rewrote his report again printed it out for me, and gave me a copy of that chest X-ray {which I still have with me to this very date in time…}, he did another test on me again and this time he gave me a copy right then and there…. This is why they can no-longer give you a copy/or tell anything of what they may have found in you or your body system…. “So if they really are dumb enough to trust those lying butt wipes then there is something more going on here that may meet the eyes guys!!” And if I am in that system and when I repeatly told them no, and a thousand times’ no, than I want my cut of the action and I am asking for $Billion-plus heartache…”

    2. Believe it is a hoax. It is all about money. I would have to really see facts before I would ever have a different perspective. I have about had it with this government and this country.

    3. Good post Seymore. Interesting how long Dr. Nass’ research has stood against any other study, but years later, in 2015 no less, this hack publishes his report based on theory?

      Did it really take them this long to come up with that brain fart?

  52. If the information the VA puts in is true, accurate, and some directives didn’t tell Dr.’s just falsify the input, if.. Who said that the VA can use our information? Where does the money go? What’s Dr. Shulkin’s share/bonus? I just don’t trust.

    1. The VA is permitted to use your information. ALL hospitals have you sign their terms of agreement which include sharing data for purposes of research, insurance, contractors and I think one other I can’t remember right now. You probably just don’t recall the paperwork you signed upon your first visit or exam. Whenever possible the information shared is aggregate data.

      1. That is utter Bullshit “Dawn/JackO”. Althought they do try to ask research subjects to sign an information sharing release. It is in no way a standard procedure to ask for the release.

      2. I too call bullshit on that. I cannot think of a single research study in which access to health records is allowed by some bullshit generic agreement, without the subject knowing what the research is for.

        So if you used the VA and signed this paperwork, and 10 years later the VA uses your data in an HIV study without your agreement, you say that is OK?

      3. I’m just guessing here but I am thinking “JackO” wears a funny hat in the VA swamp.

  53. Nerve pain cause failure to check notification blocks.
    Second attempt. Following.

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