Veterans Affairs Opioid Safety Initiative

Veterans Affairs Boasts About Opioid Reduction Initiative Success

Veterans Affairs Opioid Safety Initiative

Department of Veterans Affairs researchers boasted that fewer veterans are using opioids after an agency initiative stripped veterans of this treatment modality.

As the Tomah VA scandal was breaking, VA embarked on its Opioid Safety Initiative (OSI) in 2013. That VA initiative resulted in a 30% reduction in veterans using opioids, according to the agency report relayed by Friedhelm Sandbrink, MD. Basically, within four years, VA reduced the number of veterans taking opioids from 679,000 to 471,000.

RELATED: Tomah VA Psychiatrist Fired Over Opioid Abuse Scandal

The caveat of the story though is that VA failed to incorporate any measure into the initiative about the number of veterans who seek opioids outside VA as a result of the treatment limitations.

This means the announcement from VA was generally false because they could not know if the veterans truly went off opioids or if they got them from a non-VA entity.

As we all know, countless veterans have had their painkillers withheld once the OSI initiative was in place, which resulted in veterans experiencing extreme pain and distress.

What appears more likely is that VA engaged in an experiment to see how many veterans they could take off opioids after VA doctors got them hooked on opioids.

Nonetheless, this lack of data concerning whether veterans truly went off opioids did not stop members of the press from publishing stories titled, “Fewer Vets on Opioids Following VA Initiative”.

This latter issue means the OSI announcement was pure propaganda. Key decisionmakers within VA and outside VA will see the study as a great success merely by looking at titles associated with the research – – click bait.

It reminds me of a Facebook debate I got into last night. (Facebook debates are a waste of time, but I sometimes indulge myself.)

Facebook Rant – Evangelicals = Taliban?

Last night, I came across an article with the clickbait title, “It’s Time to Start Calling Evangelicals What They Are: The American Taliban”.

The author of the article on does go on to qualify what he meant, but that does not change the nature of the clickbait title.

I responded rather forcefully in part because I was raised Evangelical and the comparison within the clickbait title was offbase.

Here is what I wrote in response for your own amusement if you are unable to view the actual Facebook post:

Total clickbait.

This author preys on the ignorance of atheists and non-Evangelicals when writing this piece since it is inconsistent with reality on its face.

Do you know how often I saw women worshiping Christ alongside men as equals in an Evangelical service?

EVERY time.

Do you know how often women and men worship together in the Taliban in Afghanistan, next to each other as equals?

ZERO times. It is forbidden at risk of stoning.

Do you know how often I saw women wear mandatory sheets over their faces while I worshiped Christ in an Evangelical church as a kid?

ZERO times. Women were not forbidden to show their face.

Do you know how often I was involved in a stoning of a woman or any other person who deviated from the teachings of Christ?

ZERO times, but you can watch a youtube video regularly of a woman, generally forced into sex slavery by marriage, who was eventually stoned for pushing back.

Evangelicals are not the American Taliban. There is no “American” Taliban last I checked, and Evangelicals certainly do not support stoning.

To state as much is an insult to both the Taliban and Evangelicals.

Taliban have extreme views that include stoning sinners and prohibiting women from worshipping God alongside men.

Get real. Get educated. Read and think for yourself. Being a liberal should not also mean you need to snub your nose at every religious person just because you hate God.

Most Evangelicals and Taliban do not hate God. They just have a different idea on how to serve the God they believe in. But most liberals who subscribe to this argument generally hold disdain against any people who believe in either version of the God of Abraham.

Here are a few videos to illustrate the practice of selling daughters into sex slavery as child wives who are later mutilated or stoned by the Taliban:

Clickbait, Propaganda And VA

Now, my perspective on clickbait on Facebook also extends to what VA does on a regular basis. Their public relations folks (the taxpayer funded propaganda arm of VA) continually engineer and structure press releases with the goal of creating a false perception within the public.

The above example, where VA grabs headlines by falsely asserting their initiative was a great success at reducing opioid use while not actually knowing if what they are asserting is true.

For decades, VA was effective at curating the message and forming public opinion about VA until 2014, when America was outraged to learn the agency abused its authority and lied to the public about how it really treats veterans.

It was then that CNN broke the infamous wait time scandal starting in Phoenix that was later found to be present at practically every VA health care facility nationwide.

We also had the attempted cover-up of opioid abuse at Tomah VA that was simultaneously exposed. It was on the back of the Tomah VA scandal that the agency created the OSI plan.

However, numerous veterans report the initiative is wrongly withholding painkillers from veterans who have no other alternative.

To get at this, I plan to take a simple poll / survey on Sunday to see how many veterans believe they were harmed by the opioid reduction experiment.

But for now, what do you think about the opioid reduction plan at VA. Was this an experiment guided by politics or real treatment conferring value and benefit for injured veterans?

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  1. I went back and read all the posts here about this topic.

    Please don’t buy the BS about “cbd” oil or any products that contain cbd isolate.
    It’s made from a GMO plant they created.
    It’s not natural cannabis plant, it’s a commercially prepared GMO drug.
    Who really knows what is in it?? Or what it is?

    Most people here seem like in love with the medical system and trying to get them to do right. It’s not going to happen, the whole thing is based on fraud and lies.

    Use plants.

    1. To Hannah,,,,,,ditto,,,,ANY PLANT,,, they-don’t care we suffer in physical pain from medical errors,,WAR,,, they simply could give a shit we are literally using death to stop our physical pain since the government,ignorantLY AND ARROGANTLY used people in the media,,who our opiate phobs,,,they don’t care were dieing in agonizing physical aipn,,,when the system fails you,,,make your own system,,,,Before 1913 with thee completely prejudicial Harrison act against ,”negro’s.”’ ALL medicinal plant were legal..Thomas Jefferson,,who wrote many thing,,but in-particular,,”when ANY FORM of Government evinces by design,to reduce its citizens to absolute despotism,,it is our duty,our right,,to alter or abolish it,,,,,,,””’AMEN!!!!!! 1993 THE dea RAIDED THOMAS JEFFERSON’S HISTORICAL HOME,.,, went into the federally historical marker gardens,,and pulled all of Thomas Jefferson flowers,,specifically a poppy flower he brought here 1774,,,,THERE’s ,”OUR” government hard at work,,,with their false ,”drug war”,,,,sickening aint it!!!!!!!!MARY

  2. Thanks, my hands are still shaking.
    If I were kinda kinky I would go with the suppositories. ☺ ☻

    1. Why are hands shaking? Because of what I wrote?

      Kinky or not, sometimes people are too sick or digestion too screwed to ingest meds. Suppositories are widely used in Europe as it can be fast acting when needed. And, people with colon, rectal cancer, IBS or other digestive tract ailments can directly target the cancer with the meds. I saw a before and after vid on you tube where the guy had colonoscopy pics before and after, he had IBS. before you could see the bloody, pus-filled, inflammed colon. he was dying from malnutrition as his food didn’t digest and his life was painful miserable, as you can imagine, because all eating would send digestion into painful spasm.

      then he started taking enemas from raw cannabis juice, and between used coconut oil suppositories, so his intestines were always ‘under the influence’. within weeks, he was cured. his last colonoscopy showed no signs of IBS, inflammation, pockets of pus + blood or anything else.

      1. My hands shake normally from what I don’t know. When I wrote this yesterday I was shaking even more furiously due to the adrenaline rush I felt from my anger. I had an MRI done of my neck last year and after having it done as well as an EMG I asked my PCP at the time to ask for a consult from the neurologist. I never heard from her. 6 mons passed and I again sked for an appointment. By this time my PCP quit and this is the terse reply I got from someone who was to be on my new PCP’s team.
        “I am the covering physician and have reviewed your records and Neurology notes.
        The tremors are benign essential tremors (unknown cause). Not suggestive of
        Parkinson’s disease. These will likely persist lifelong and may worsen during
        times of stress. Treatment options are very limited and usually do not make them
        go away completely. You can address this in further detail at your next
        appointment. Per Dr. Bhalla. ”

        That’s it your hands shake we don’t know why you’re old, deal with it.”

  3. I am a veteran and have been taking Vicodin for over 10 years thanks to the VA. A couple of years ago they started their crackdown as the article indicates. I am 71 and received a broken back in 1967 which has now manifested itself as arthritis in the lower spine as well as age disc degeneration. I have been dealing with this situation for the past three years on a pact between my doctor and me that I would ask him every month for a new prescription and I would take a pee test every three months. Well my doctor left the VA (I’ve had 5 PCP’s in the 10 or 12 years I’ve gone to the VA). My new doctor demanded a pee test every month and to attend the same drug safety test I’ve already been through every 1-2 months. Now I have been a model citizen. I pay my taxes and vote in every election, haven’t ever been accused of a crime and not even a traffic or parking ticket or accident for at least 30 years. I am refusing this maltreatment by the VA even if it means going through a self induced withdrawal. He suggested acupuncture treatments as a solution 2-3 times weekly. Also a chiropractor, specifically told by a VA Back specialist not to do. That’s it folks, their solution. I quit the VA doctor today and will go back to the PCP I had before the VA. Still in practice and will be for some time to come. Fortunately, Arizona has medical marijuana and I am free to pursue its healing value. I haven’t smoked weed since I was in my 30’s, but thanks to the VA I am now able to try it as the VA has nothing else to offer me. By the way, for other VET’s to know, you can go to a Medicare or private doctor and have the VA if you are at 100%, pay for the medicines. Make sure you look into this. Not many know about it.

    1. Sorry to hear about your troubles.
      You’ll be extra glad one day, when using cannabis, it’s so much better for pain and life.
      Smoking won’t help much, but gives fast relief.
      Cook high grade flowers low heat in coconut or olive or caster oil or mix n match oils.
      Or in crock pot, with water in it, then put stainless steel container with flowers inside, cover flowers with oil, don’t cover, cook for as long as you want, longer the better up to a point.
      overnight, 2 days, etc.
      you can rub oil on your skin or take internal or brush your teeth or drop under tongue or all. some make suppositories. you find ways to use it. use common sense, start slow, you can’t overdose no matter what. you might take too much and be uncomfortable for awhile but these aren’t ususally probs for opiate takers are sturdy people. you have to be.
      good luck.

      ps. you can also make ‘rick simpson oil’ there’s millions of you tube videos about these things.

      Dennis here is an eloquent writer; he could chime in about this with info.

      1. Thank you Hannah I have been searching for a simple way to make the recipe you have posted

  4. Just got an update on the media doing the story on the Roudebush VAMC and the pain medication problem. This is what I was sent from the reporter:

    I just had an interview questioning the Northern Indiana VA’s Chief Medical Officer about the issue. Due to the scope of this problem, I’m having to focus more specifically on the Marion VA as an example of what appears to be a nationwide problem.
    It will take at least 2-3 days to finish transcribing the interviews and then several days to edit, so it will be a few more weeks before this airs.
    I know this is taking a while, but this kind of digging, vetting and fact-checking takes quite a bit of time!

    I take that to be the story will be nothing. The Feds, state, and/or the TV station has shut this down. I started e-mailing the reporter on 1 Dec. 2016. Now it was all a waste of time. I had a feeling things were not going well as I had not heard anything from the reporter since Feb. I had e-mailed a couple of times and received not response.
    It looks as if the VA wins again in the great state of Indiana. This state is very non-veteran when it comes to trying to right a wrong done by the VAMC. I will let you know when and if the story actually does air.
    I will have to say I am not in any way surprised about how this turned out.

    1. Wow! This site or page is now all purple for some reason.

      That’s how I figured it would turn out Figure8. We don’t have real representation or real media or journalist in Indiana let alone in college towns where everything is supposed to be so groovy, perfect, with no negatives or corruption or crime. Ha. Investigative reporters which locally we have none stay away from issues such as this. No one dares report on the state’s negatives that may harm the phony facade the Hoosier state has the sheep believing in.

      I have talked to so-called journalist college professors and all they care about is censoring and making the news, not reporting facts and real needful news and reports. Of course as they smile and repeat the slogan of them “will defend your rights to news and freedom of speech/expression to our death.” Of course that is all communist/Marxist BS.

      I have put ads up on Craigslist and have one on their now I could barely type to get put up, but had to just get it done. Next I will try the Indy news paper if they will allow my trying to find other Hoosier vets that have been through what we, or I have. Especially what we were told and treated in the new pain clinic crap.

      I get zero responses on anything I have tried. Local vets and groups don’t want bothered by others problems or have to remain politically correct and kiss butt in case some legion or something needs favors from the local politicians or business tyrants and libtards who run the town. They all also support the censoring, retaliation, gossip, and hate towards anyone who dares speak some truth and disagree with their fascist agendas. While putting on a good show about caring for vets and individuals…which they actually don’t when the cameras are off.

      With the ads, the groups I have tried joining on Facebook, I will have some magnetic signs made up to stick on my vehicles about the F-ing VA and how corrupt Terre Haute and the state of Indiana is. And maybe couple more for Trump flip-flopping so far on some things. However I expected that much when he put two corrupt butt-wipes in his admin like Coats and Pence that again in a long list of traitors ignore the censoring here, the nepotism, propaganda, media jesters, corruption and lies that encompasses everything in the state of Indiana.

      1. T
        I finally got a flag in my records because I e-mailed the Roudebush VAMC and proved they lied to me. My flag report states that it was die to an incident on march 28. I had no appointment that day. I did e-mail a couple of things and that is what they used to flag me. Now it is in my record for two years.
        I was also told that i am to be quiet and agree with whatever they say. If I disagree, I am to be considered as “threatening and/or bullying” and my appointment will stop and I will be escorted from the premises.
        It is all about them controlling the veterans. They want to send me to the new pain clinic and I am refusing to go. I am sure this will be taken as “refusal of treatment” and that will allow them to completely do whatever they want to do (or so they think). So much stupidity goes on at the Indy VAMC.

      2. Sorry to hear that news but that’s how they roll in Indiana. Mainly because all the VA staff and other assorted trash in Indiana know we have no avenue to expose all the corruption going on. No recourse unless we are connected or related to someone special or part of some clique. It’s really bad when civilian MDs do the same thing and refuse us our files or lie for the VA and what they may have done to us. So, the whole damn sheebang of “professionals” and their boards to politicians and more are in support of this crap. If we had real representation, real concerned vet groups, and a real media with real journalist this state and town would not be so damn corrupted and so many people ignorant of some truth and facts about life and being brain-washed from birth. Then on to be bullied by the VA, officials, reps, unions and the rest for not being silent or daring to question the state of affairs here. Then again all my life I’ve seen this stuff going on and tried to fight it but it does no good and just makes plenty of enemies on all sides.

        The X-VA employee I talked to for a little bit after the pain clinic orientation said it’s the VA way and have always done this crap. You either be quiet while they kill, neglect, play intentional games, ruin lives, and abuse us, appease the special interest group types, don’t upset the Marx Feminist or “empowered females there, or they can easily force us out or make our lives miserable. If we are white we aren’t supposed to say a word, question anything, just let them abuse and destroy.

        I chose to say to hell with them all. Like other stories I have heard over the years, there is no way I will continue on with there corrupt bullying stuff for care and risk being forced by their cops to be locked up in their nut ward for three days, and injected with their dope to pacify their needs or wants. That was done to one guy just for having disagreements with one of his clinics feminist, then tried to leave. My trust is gone is the VA and the state entirely. Losing more of it dealing with some foul civilians and some workers who seem to fear talking about the weather let alone asking them if they have dealt with other vets leaving the VA. You can see their body language and color rush out of their face like they are going in front of a firing squad or something. Oh gee let’s not have enough courtesy and freedom to discuss some real life issues or try to get some information in this Soviet Union styled state where people even fear talking or sharing info or giving simple advice.

        My advice to people is, we are watched and recorded about everywhere today. We should do the same and always record at the VA whether they like it or not, or agree to it or not. We have to be our own advocates and protect ourselves from our well known enemies and their tactics. I think they are killing too many of us off either by slow or fast kill. There are too many activist, liars, scum. and etc., in the VA, clinics, towns, to trust any of them one iota. Besides, it’s the old communist and activist trick to blame others while they are doing the bullying, lying and attacking. We don’t have to do anything but dare to ask a simple question to asking why we drove a hundred miles for a appointment to be told the clinic is done with us and nothing more can be done. Then place the blame on me or us. Real nice people we deal with at the VA.

        It’s a real pity we have to see all this evil and corruption passed down to yet another generation that may be totally unaware of the reality of it all. Unless they are a very lucky one, or totally dependent and needful to take chances with the VA and the lousy gubberment that is so corrupted it’s beyond pathetic.

        Try to have a good evening 8 and all.

  5. Here it goes AGAIN, after firing some supposed “brother” as a care giver who said, “sometimes we need to suck it up”!?! Of course it was explained to him pointedly that NO PERSON will tell me to accept that which was identified as “improper and negligent medical treatment, that led directly to the complete internal destruction of what was a healthy young man”! I returned to AORs, I remained in them even after injurues were identified, and GLADLY, I sucked it up to remain with my folks until the rotation was deemed complete!
    Ive NEVER gone toxic, though, they perscribed morphine to me twice that caused a complete physical, and mental, catastrophe! I could not eat, was sick to the extent of GI pain and undescribable headaches, along with causing most of my “triggers” to go off of the chart…and DID NOTHING for my pain!?! The methadone was limited, was never requested to be increased, nor NEVER, did I need a refill early!
    I keep it basic, simply to minimize HORRIFIC bilateral shoulder pain, caused by complete destruction of all tissues in the entire area! Muscle, bone, cartilage etc was damaged with more than 20- deviations in both shoulders, requiring COMPLETE REPLACEMENT that is denied at least another 7 years (55 is the minimal age I was told) not to mention, treating me for psciatica was ultimately determined to be damged vertabrae/discs and was not identified properly until 7 years after I was medically retired after serving nearly 19 years!
    Now, we are readdressing, after it was determined that my plan was a success and that I had not a single abuse issue with a minimal amount, that I agreed, I could mange properly! Today, my oerscription arrived, reassigned to another Doctor (the one I fired for his filthy comment) with 1/4 of my regular perscription! No notice, no preparation, and my doctor who acted with compassion, removed and returned me from the morphine nightmare, WHICH ALMOST KILLED ME DURING THE FIRST SURGERY AND WAS IDENTIFIED AS SEPTIC TO MY SYSTEM, was reassigned!? Of course many of the spots I had questioned due to a previous skin cancer bout, were positively identified as active skin cancer (which my blood family, who relocated to Florida for over 50 years never had a single issue with, while I served abroad)!
    Once again, quality of life is a flip switch pushed as numbers while we see a media/national push to ensure proper medical care! All of which the administrations fill our care giver/service positions with garbage people to serve our nation’s PROVEN positive resource in veterans! Veterans who agreed to serve under legal contract to receive care/benefits in the advent of problems that many WILL experience!
    Headed to my political “leadership” to get someone involved…AGAIN!

  6. I hate you trendy luberals, do you onow why 22 vets try and commit suicide daily, because we hurt. Every nerve in my body is not right, gut, to lungs, to spinal cord and all my extremities. So, the VA, changes policey, cuts us all off, problem solved, fuck no…wait till we start getting even…

    1. Sign the petition in too repeal those genocidal,torturous, propaganda guidelines,lets get rid of every single bullshit re-scheduling,,every rule,every bullshit propaganda article;research,,this ,”false flag opiate epidemic was a lie,10000%%%%it was based on lie,liers,and a medias willing to spread the lies,,,u get 1 % of a young adult who abuses,lies to their doctor etc,,and THEIR PARENTS seek revenge,,,,for the ADULT sons’ death,,,and we alll are paying for their revenge in their hearts,,,,how is taking away MEDICINE,, from a medically ill humanbeing helpful????its not,,,it kills him,,, for NO NORMAL human being would want to live life in forced physical pain everyday,,exactly like being tortured physically every day,,except the physical; pain is with-in our bodies,,,it truly is a bunch of arrogant idiots,,who think they have the right to decide,,,who suffers in physical pain,,and who does not,,,,for it it factually impossible for anyone to physically feel the physical pain of another,,,yet these a-holes think they have to rite to force u,,,to suffer in physical pain,,,,Good luck in hell,,,you arrogant idiots,,,,for how u treated us,,will be 5 Times worse,,when u croak,,,,and rite-fully soo!!!!!!CHECK OUT MR. LAWHERNS ARTICLE,,ON THIS COMPLETELY FALSE FLAG OPIATE EPIDEMIC,,,THE TRUTH IS FINALLY TOLD,,MARYW,,,,

    2. We luberals hurt too. I quit my VA in AZ today and fortunately I have Medicare ( A luberals program) and. from what I read, I can get the VA to pay fro my drugs. I am 71 and am now going to start smoking weed again after 40 years, and in Un luberal Arizona. Good luck to you and all of us. We are all in this together.

  7. test shaka 4:
    ———–ka maluhia

  8. The VA’s OSI was a complete and utter joke and travesty. And you are correct, when I saw the political writing in the wall about pain meds in 2013 I insisted upon Fee Basis Civilian Pain Management, and that’s exactly where I have been since this non sense began. But each an every Rx that my civilian PM writes, my local VA pharmacy fills.
    Veterans and civilian pain patients are dying, either from strokes and heart attacks from severe untreated pain or Street drug overdose and sucicide, once again from untreated pain.
    Whether or not the government, the DEA, the CDC, the huge greedy rehab industry, or the screaming parents of children that have died of OD’s like it or not these medications serve an important purpose: the treatment of severe and intractable pain. And it’s murder(yes, death boards in my opinion) to take away these life saving medications from Vets and other CPP’s that are stable and doing well.
    The greed of the rehab industry and addicts that want to blame everything from the medication itself to the Dr to the manufacturer, without taking any responsibility for their own actions, are the cause of these terrible crisis.
    There is no opioid “epidemic” if you look at the real numbers, not the made up shit from the CDC. But there is a pandemic of severe chronic pain that is now being severely under treated or not treated at all. It’s a travesty.
    We need to work on safe haven laws that protect the truly ill patients access to these medications and protect the Drs that treat them.
    Politics has no damn place in my Drs office or my treatment plan.

    1. JS,
      First I was told I was taking too many tablets a month. I was prescribed 120 5mg tablets. These are to be weaned down to 60 tablets a month. I have just told my PCP to drop my tablets to 60 a month next month, however, change the dosage to 10mg tablets. This gets it down to the paper I was forced to sign. If I did not sign the my PCP informed me she would not prescribe the medication. I had not choice but to take the lesser of the two evils. I was then told that it was not about the amount I was taking, it was what the OSI calls for. I then proved them wrong on that. Now I am being told it is for my own good so I will not have the side effects of taking opioids for a long time. I have been taking them since 2012. I did have s small amount of time when the Roudebush VAMC decided they would abruptly stop them. this was when I moved back to Indiana. This also caused me to become homeless.
      Since then, I did finally get the pain med restarted, became employed at a job I love, have my own housing, my bills are paid every month, and I have money in the bank. This is all due to having the proper and correct pain medication. Now that it is goin got be weaned down, I will lose everything I have achieved.
      I have continuously asked how am I to deal with the increase in pain as I will be getting NOTHING to help to replace and/or accompany the med. I am told that “they understand my concern but this is for what could happen.”
      I have tried all of the non-narcotic pain meds, Physical therapies, topical creams, patches, and injections.
      the Roudebush VAMC is also trying to force the Pain Clinic on me again. They are acting as if I had not been there before and the are making sure to put in my records that it is being offered and I am refusing to go. I will not go through that again. It is a bunch of lying, two faced, better than you are, Gods. They made me out to be a drug addict who was only interested in opioids. I was also labeled as “drug seeking”. This of course are all complete lies.
      I am not sure what is going to happen. I received an e-mail from the reporter and the reporter is supposed to be doing some interviews today. I did not get an answer on the releasing of the name of the private doctor who is looking at our VAMC medical records. I am hoping this story will get released soon or it may be too late for us.
      Your post is very true and I am in complete agreement with you.

    2. amen JS,,,,,,,,,propaganda,media ,”witch hunts,” have ;literally killed people,,maryw

  9. I’m not sure if it’s of any relief or more shit to worry about, but there are pockets of corruption in every business and government, and even charitable sector of organizations. I don’t mean each organization individually is corrupt, but rather corrupt individuals and corrupt groups of individuals pervade otherwise principled organizations. Basically, there are many other people harmed and effectively, even efficiently, silenced, ignored, marginalized in the same manner as vets… DuPont, for example, has put forth some transformative science that has made lives for people around the world tremendously better, while also polluting and poisoning others with little consequence; heck, they enjoy quite a bit of corporate welfare from the government. I don’t bring this up to negate anything that the vets are dealing with, none, of any of it, is ever acceptable. But there is a little hope, because some times whistle blowers have success, and even live to see it. Two cops in Chicago got about a million bucks each and there is now an outside investigation into some of the dirtiest cops; there are wrongful convictions being overturned and thrown out and innocent people regaining their freedom. I don’t know if Snowden is a dirty word around here, but he is living in self-imposed exile to bring americans the truth about our own government spying on us. Maybe Glenn Greenwald or associated writers at The Intercept would be interested in doing an expose. Wikileaks could also be a great platform to expose what is going on; Wikileaks is strictly a collection of documents whereas The Intercept does investigative journalism, in case anyone is not familiar. Facebook is social media, meant for connecting with friends and family; while people can share news articles to spread their message, personal posts are viewed as unsubstantiated sort of gossip. It’s important to be cautious about the image we project of ourselves on social media if we want to be taken seriously, because nothing online can ever truly be deleted.

    I also see a lot of conversation about some of the new medical treatments involving electric shock/stimulation. I totally see why anyone receiving medical or mental healthcare from the government is apprehensive, to put it mildly. Some of these treatments may be worth looking into in the private sector, it’s not the electric shock therapy depicted in American Horror Stories Asylum. People actually voluntarily undergo EST for conditions like bipolar disorder, which are administered under anestesia, and find it very helpful. There are also spinal stimulaters that successfully alleviate pain. Again, it makes sense for anyone to be reluctant to allow the government to perform procedures like this, just don’t rule them out solely for that reason.

  10. Kinda wondering if anyone has read any of the articles about the number of people “dying from despair”? The one on Reason, a libertarian news site, goes over the study and mentions some statistics about how many of those who died were on prescription pain medication “including opioids”, and then closes by saying how opioids need to be reigned in. This is antithetical to libertarian ideology, but what’s more is how exactly does the author conclude that reigning in the opioids would reduce these deaths? Did it not occur to the author that the reason people were often drinking while taking opioids is because their pain was not being sufficiently managed in the first place? That perhaps, if these people did have their pain managed adequately, they could work or otherwise participate in activities that made them feel like a contributing member of society again? That by managing the pain, the depression that accompanies chronic pain would be mitigated?
    Also, I haven’t seen if the study presents how many of these people dying of despair are veterans?
    I have noticed that there is a parallel between the way veterans are treated and the way the incarcerated are treated. Authorities with zero accountability and liability, backed by union thugs, hold any and all information pertaining to their charge (charge meaning vet or inmate). These authorities choose how much and when, if at all, they disclose or release even when the information is lawfully sought and they are “bound” by law to hand it all over. And even then, they keep double books or alter records to meet their “story” If the charge gets too uppity or bothersome, or tries go above their head or get media attention, then they punish the charge; inmates may get indefinite solitary confinement, beat by COs, conveniently left vulnerable to other inmate’s attacks, or even deprived of food, water, or urgent medical care. Veterans are being denied medication, treatment or visits with their preferred provider, refused suicide prevention assistance, forced to face inquisition and potential monetary punishment. Some veterans are even ignored and mistreated until they disappear into a life of homelessness. The integrity of veterans and defendants is routinely attacked: this person is crazy and refuses the medicine we say the need, all the while ignoring devastating side effects, or this person is fundamentally violent- because they are black, or taking certain drugs (medicine), have been in combat or trained for combat- and therefore we the authorities must control said person because you never know when they will turn on you. It seems to me that when a person snaps and commits random acts of violence, that there is a common denominator of having being pushed around by government authorities for just too long. Hell, the phrase “going postal” is derived from the time a man shot up the post office he worked at because he was harassed mercilessly by his employer, a government entity. And the force that is supposed to catch the perpetrators of violence and protect the people from other’s harm, is none other than root cause of much of that violence, the government.
    I am no “fan” of Trump (he is no less a statist than clinton and I am a libertarian) but I do wish him success- which I would measure by how well our country is doing. On his campaign website he had laid out some excellent ideas to reform the VA, unfortunately he (or whoever came up with them) didn’t know that every concept had already been tried and failed. But ending recognition of public sector unions collective bargaining, which would fix problems in numerous government agencies, is political, perhaps even personal life, suicide. And his campaign promises to fight he opioid epidemic, well he’s gonna try to make good on that promise. I guarantee there will be no scaling back on control over doctor patient relationships nor will there be any money spent on medication based treatment, such as methadone or suboxen. Why am I so sure? Because he has appointed Chris Christie to chair this initiative.

    1. Sadly ErinJ,,,,do the math,,,its 7482 ,,that we know of,, vets a year that are being FORCED to choose death as their only way to stop physical pain from war injuries,,,this is literally 1/2 of the extra 22,000 a year more that are now dieing since Dr.Government has forced their way into our healthcare,,,,,,I said early I ask my senator Tammy Baldwin,,,,,to please put on all death certificate a box,,,,for all coroners,,,”death due to untreated physical pain,”,,,,,I was told to ,”prove it,”’,,,,thus NO,,, she refused….”they want no record of our death,,,for it is a legal document those death certificates,,,thus a way for us to prove willfull genocide and torture,,,maryw

  11. Sorry for the typos. Just not doing good today and wanting/needing to vent and spread some info.Sorry.

  12. Gabapentin will mess you up. I know of people on that for pain or epilepsy who committed suicide after telling us the side effects they had and could not live that way any longer.

    They tried me on that stuff plus the head dope for years. I could not tolerate of function with 100mg of that stuff and they wanted me to do 400 t0 1000mg a day. Hell, I couldn’t make out my bills under their claimed ‘clinical dosages’ let alone drive on all that crap, and would not. I asked the idiot speaker; well what if I bowed to your demands, drove when I know I should not and killed someone.” He said, ” That would be a personal problem for you wouldn’t it?” “Stuff happens.” And then all law enforcement in Indiana plus the politicians, medical boards agree with this or they said ” all supported everything from the top.”

    Pain orientation told me they would ‘force’ me to take want they wanted and would take it again or else. And they would demand I drive the couple hundred miles in all weather and night to see them.

    All I get now is from a civy MD is gout meds. The new pain clinic civy MD where I had to sit for 6 hours to see told me they over use Gaba and never take it again. I told me I did a long time ago. Then he he gave me one script for pain med I was using and told me to go back to the VA, there is too much wrong with you. Just like my Hosptial clinic civy PCP told me to do. Until I told him for like the tenty time, I will lay at home, suffer, and die first before I go back to the VA.

    Or, thinking, trust any doctor today cut into me to fix the aneurysm. No way. When civilian MDs and clinics are doing what the VA is, lost files, different staff, lost tests, treating me piece-meal instead of my whole body, then I am done. I will work more on my death and last wishes than wasting time hunting for decent honest non-game playing health care in this corrupt state. Especially since civy MD and oral surgeon covered up for the VA dental clinic and again had to fight to get my records from him for months. And did not get the file I seen in his office being written out. And had to write, call, email, everybody in the state offices to try to get that file with them saying nothing can be done, and medical boards denying my issue, like the attorney general did. So Indiana for some people, is not a good place to live. Good place for torture and corruption but not to live or raise kids in.

    1. T,
      You see, but you do not observe – Sherlock Holmes
      They are all in cahoots:
      a slang noun meaning:
      1.) To be in league with a crime, or conspiracy. Also to mean in alliance with or secret partnership with.
      Can you see it now.

      1. Oh I see and understand very well. That is why I write what I do and about how seemingly the entire state of things here have those symbiotic relations to retain and gain power, prestige, to ruin, profit, cover-up evil and wrong doing. It’s why VA staff that feel wronged can easily have their friends and family use their position to see it that some of us suffer the retaliation from them all. Thinking I am, or some one else with complaints are out for their cushy jobs, which is not true. But that’s how it works. We want some change and decency, they all flex their muscles where they can to do harm. I have written before about the whole sheebang is in total cahoots with each other from one office to another, to one activist group or vet group to another and on it goes.

        The above with all the deep seated corruption is why all of our media refuses truth. And why locally we have no real media or real investigative journalist. So I am not kidding a bit when I say living in Indiana with the state and locals having those direct lobbyist and activist ties to Washington DC and the many activist groups out there is truth. Just like living in the Gaza Strip minus the missiles so far, like living in NI. Korea, or Red China. The censoring, damages, threats, legal maneuvering, inability to function and have what other silent sheep citizens is also real. I’ve had to deal with it on every level and concern out there. Road rights, property rights, difficulty is finding insurance, zoning issues, ignored by judges with good cases only to be told “good case, properly prepared with witnesses. You need to learn there are some people you don’t sue or fool with here.” “Case dismissed, Mr. T you can leave now. Don’t waste your time waiting to be seen again.” I did wait. He called the case number, I stood up, he said, I’ve already dismissed this case, have a good day.” That is a small sample of how the town works. Behind closed doors, minutes of meetings shut off, dark allies or roads, parking lot, or what I find in my yard, or damage done. That is old mafia and activist styled game playing and pretty sad when town officials don’t care and city council member support the crap off camera. And love to censor and make sure there is no use attending any meetings or trying to start up local groups for change. When thee is this much corruption and media cover-up the authorities and all in cahoots, can do whatever they desire. Especially since none of them up there seem to have no no conscious like the VA, and must love torturing small varmints, pulling wings off of flies, or suppressing, attacking others who they merely don’t like or agree with.

        I know it all very well and the players.

  13. To nuttervet,,,I did not know that a ,”set precedence,” was needed for lawsuit???I thought the very act of willfull torture onto another human being,,,and thee act of willful genocide onto a group of people based upon their medical needs,,,,,, by a government entity would be more then enough for a lawsuit,,since both results in the murder and or death of a human being,,,,maryw

    1. @mary – Outright murder, no problem. When your talking about some one dies because of not receiving pain medications, along with the Government on the big push to reduce the amount of prescribed pain meds, this may be an issue. But again, you know how these people think. I know what your referring too Mary, and I’m waiting for a hot shot attorney to challenge them in the very near future.

      1. Talking to a ,”state aclu,” I was told we must prove ,”harm,” and we can,,,34,000 letters sent to Government Officials stating harm has been done to 34,000 so far is harm,,thee increase of 22,000 deaths,,Since Dr.Government has bullied there way into a ADULT medical decisions,,,is death of a group of people,,,jmo,I believe thee attorneys DON’T HAVE THE BALLS,,, to do what is right,ethical and moral,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,so-far,,,,,,,,,,
        I have written the U.N in Geneva on all of this,,,,and they agree,,what the United States is doing to the medically ill by denying access to effective,timely medicine to prevent/lessen severe physical pain is torture,,,but,,,,they lack thee legal authority to formally charge the U.S,,,,,,but,,,they do know what the U.S is up too,,which I am sure does not sit well with alll thee other countries on this planet,,,MARY

      2. @MARY – There must be proof to show intent. I don’t know what the legal criteria is to meet these standards. But, by only people sending in letters, if they don’t meet the criteria, they can send letters as much as they want. As far as for the attorneys, if there was easy money for a short period of legal time, they’d eat that up all day long. Most are greedy, and believe me, once the doors open up in this area of law, the hungry wolves will be trotting through to the bank.


      4. @Mary – Mary chill. I didn’t say that I didn’t agree with you, I do agree with you. But how the law is set up is how it is set up. I’m fighting too, and I’ve found a lot of scientific principles that the VA has ignored. But, until our elected officials and those with authority and influence see what is happening, things are going to be the same. I know this stuff has to stop. If I was an attorney, I’d try to stop this bullshit too. Right now, I’m fighting for my health. And these no good pricks take advantage of Veterans all day long. No heart! No compassion!

      5. its just sooooo inhumane,,,,,soo,,, not American Freedom as Adults in a free country,,,its just soooooo wrong on soo many levels,,,and its all being done WILLFULLY,,, on purpose,,,that sickens me,,,this type of America is not what I was raised in,,nor do I want our children to grow up in,,,where death,,where human life is not valued if your medical ill,,if u need medicine to live life,to simple move/breath,,,eat,,,w/out physical pain….This whole ,”addiction thingy was set up by 2 shrinks,,shrinks at 1 time were never welcome in pain management,,for if thier wrong,,,u get calcified organs,trust me,,,after there forced 10 appointment are paid for by insurers,,thats all they ever wanted,money,there was no epidemic every,,,,just a couple of shrinks,,shunned by the real medical community,,,who wanted a piece of the pie,,and our government bought their SNAKE OIL hook line and sinker,,,IT IS PENNHURST,,,,,,ALL OVER AGAIN,,,AND PEOPLE ARE DIEING,,,IN PHYSICAL PAIN,,,WHEN THERE WAS ONCE MEDICINE,,USED RESPONSIBLE BY 97% OF US,, AND NOW,,,,WERE DIEING,,,BECAUSE THAT MEDICINE WAS FORCIBLE DENIED ACCESS TO BECAUUSE 2 SHRINKS WANTED THEIR ,”ADDICTION CENTERS FILLed UP,,,,,,,,THATS SICKENING,,,NOT TO MENTION CRIMINALLY ILLEGAL,,,WHEN TORTURE AND GENOCIDE IS NOW LEGAL IN AMERICA,,,,ITS NO LONGER,,,,,,THEE AMERICA OUR FORE FATHER DESIGNED,,,,NOR 1 I WILL EVER ACCEPT,,,FOR ITS WRONG,CRUEL,, BARBARIC,,AND INHUMANE,,,,,,MARYW

      6. MaryW It has been that way since the forming of a more perfect union, that way brought over from Europe, & before that the Romans, Greece where we get our democracy from, it goes that way as far back as records were kept for any country, demigods making rules/laws not for all, just the lower cast. Entanglement of private interests with obligations will always be part of game.

      7. @mary – Mary, there is an opioid problem in our country. The problem is the method of how the DEA and other authorities are handling the issue. Each person is different and responds differently to treatment. But what the VA is doing, is putting all Veterans with pain into the same box and using the same type of treatment. This doesn’t work, nor will it ever work. In reality, its nothing but a money and statistics game. All numbers that makes them look good, and to fatten up their wallets. All that the VA or the DEA needs to do, is to read the posts on Ben’s blog. This will give them a very good idea of how their great [bullshit] program is working. And, the VA never wants any feedback from the Veteran on how things are going. No matter what, they’re always right. A form of narcissism running rampant. You can’t get through to a narcissist.

      8. Reply to both ,”nuttervet and nitewish,,,,,,,,,as u have read,,,my father in law worked for parts of this government,,,i shall never repeat some of his stories,,,,,,,,,NO,,,,,, not all in the government aren’t inhumane,,,a lot,,but not all,,,, this is not a inhumane country,,,,corrupt government yes,,,,but not a inhumane country,,,only if we allow it to be!!!,,,for u see,,,, I firmly believe,,,,what we do in this life,,,,,will determine our place in the next,,,,,,,and I believe in the greater GOOD,,,,,I BELIEVE in ,”good will,” towards man,,,,,,for if I ever have to make that choice,,,,to self terminate,,,due to forced endurement of physical pain,,,,,,,,Ill make the son of bitches go crazy,,,,,,hear voices,,,,etc,,,,,,,and thru death,,,,,,,the greater good will be accomplished,,,,for it simply is inhumane,barbaric and archaic,,,,what there doing to ALLL CHRONIC PAIN HUMANBEIINGS,,,,WHAT HAPPENS TO OUR VETS,,,,,,WILL/IS HAPPENING TO ALL HEALTH CARE,,,all of us,, example,,,,cdc guidelines,,,,,they are now in all healthcare,,,,there is a petition to repeal them,,,soo sign it,,,repeal it,,,for the greater good,,,I believe it was never any creators plan to force any entity to suffer in physical pain or he/she would of never created the plants to lessen that physical pain,its alll wrong,,because it killing innocent human beings,,and we must fix it,,,,for the greater good of alllll mankind,,,not just me or u,,,,our kids should never have to endure the physical pain we have been forced to endure,,,,ever,,,maryw

    2. What about the Veterans Administration’s assisted suicide? I do not call it a “veteran suicide”. The veteran tried to do all he/she could do to get the help needed. The Veterans Administration failed the veteran. By that reasoning, the Veterans Administration “assisted” the veteran in his/her suicide Isn’t that the very act of willful torture onto another human being
      that is my opinion

      1. Exactly,,,I have been sayen the same thing,,,,suicide,,,is the want to end your life,,,,
        Us CPP,,,,,we do not want our life to end,,,,,we just want our physical pain from any medical condition to end,,,,not,,,,, our lives,,,,but,,when the very medicine that once lessen’d the physical pain is forcible taken,,and that physical pain is with-in our own bodies,,,we have NO CHOICE,, but to end that physical body to stop the physical pain,,via,,”self termination,” of that body,,,,,THAT IS NOT SUICIDE,,, that is self preservation,,,,,,,we don’t want to die,,,,,just the physical pain stopped,,,,BIG DIFFERENCE,,, however,,I ask my senator,,Tammy Baldwin,,to add to all death certificate a box for all coroners to be able to record our deaths as,,”death due to untreated physical pain from medical illness,”’ SHE REFUSED!!!!!1ST TELLING ME TO PROVE IT,,,,,,WOW,,,,AND THEY WANT NO RECORD OF THE DEATH/GENOCIDE THEY ARE WILLFULLY DOING,,, sooo they only record we can use,,are the number of suicides,,,maryw

      2. @figure8fan – Not to be offensive, but opinion is one thing, statues of recognized laws to submit a lawsuit is another. I know what you’re saying, but the legal beagals don’t care. No monies in opinions. Only winners in a lawsuit get the bucks.

      3. No offence taken. I know and understand what you are saying. I like to use this when I am talking to my PCP. To put the VA in front of it does not sit well with the VA folks. They do not like it when you associate something they have been told is not their fault. It briefly confuses them.

      4. @figure8fan – The VA’s objective is to confuse you when their all-in-one Evidence Based Criteria Medical Modalities fail to work for the Veteran patient. The VA strongly adheres to the belief that every Veteran with the same condition and pain, fit into the same box of treatment. Not, not even close. I’m one of them. Before I started to receive the VA’s substandard medical help, I let them know that I was in trouble a year before. Now, their solutions aren’t even close of being behind the 8-ball. I’ve been struggling with loss of muscle mass, tone, weakness, exhaustion, stress, insomnia, and PTSD symptoms are 100% kicked in full throttle. Previously, I had the PTSD symptoms under control using holistic treatments. Then screwed this all up. Now, I’m back dealing with PTSD all over again. WTF!

        I’m an Investigative Research Biologist with my back towards the corner of the wall. I feel like a rat, waiting for them to reach out to me with more bullshit before I attack them. My whole household is on edge. And now because of the additional stress, for the first time, I’m having digestive problems. I’ve never, in my lifetime, had such piss poor pain management healthcare. And, when the VA messes up or gets it wrong, oh well, it lays and stays in the laps of the Veteran.

        Lately, there have been many illegal thoughts going through my mind, that I never would even consider fumbling with in my mind. This is what the VA’s circle jerking causes the Veterans to go through with their thoughts quivering in their minds. Just sayin what I’ve been experiencing for many months.

        The VA has even promised me In-Home or Phone counseling for my PTSD, since I receive In-Home Physical Therapy. Now, they think that I can walk right into the VA Medical Center for regular appointments. Dam circle jerking when you’re suffering and trying to get better. I don’t have the time, nor do I want my wife, my K9, or myself to continue going through hoops that don’t exist, nor makes any sense. They can take their Evidence Based Criteria Medicine Treatment Protocols and literally shove up their ass. And, I’ve told them so.

  14. I recently heard some more stories about the Indiana VA and don’t even want to discuss the issues farther.

    I do find it odd that those not having pain med issues only have to do the usual blood test and only have to visit the main pain clinic once every six months. So there is a lot of BS and targeting going on for some reason to use on certain groups of vets while others see no or very little change.

    1. T, I think there is a relationship between being Gainfully employed as in working for a company & not employed considered retired. Employed get their meds, the retired get cut off.

    2. To T,,,,when did it go back to 1nce a year??????Im every 90 days,,,,,i was 1nce a year for-ever,,,cost me 250.00 bucks a year for Pain Management’—- forever,,then Dr.gOVERNMENT BULLIED THERE WAY IN,,AND PENDING YOUR MEDS,,, its is now every month or 90 days,,,,,did it go back to 1nce a year???????that would be wonderful,,a step in the rite direction 4 sure….U do know thee on;ly reason they ignored again 99% of all comment against moving the weakest meds up to schedule 2 was sooo the dea could prosecute doctors on MORE CHARGES,,, had nothing to do w/safety,,,mary

      1. Not a year. The couple of guys that would talk to me said they had to go to the main hospital pain clinic 2 times a year so they could renew their pain meds for the PCP at the CBOC to keep prescribing. They never had to attend some special pain clinic orientation, or asked to sign special contracts with the VA other that the standard Narc agreements.

        As for *their* normal blood and pee testing I don’t know. Mine began as surprise monthly tests on top of the usual every two month or so regular blood test panels. Sometimes none at all for months. Sometimes I would have tests done here in town and then again in the same day with appointments in Indianapolis. They were supposed to be monitoring me more because of the dope and anti-depressants they said were miracle cures for pain. But was the opposite, giving me severe side effects. As they scheduled my blood test at their will or surprise me with me at visits like they are going to find me dirty or something.

        For years I was on a combination of drugs until a MD from indy called me one night about midnight to tell me to get off the arthritis meds, the cholesterol meds, stop the Tylenol, etc., because I now had fatty liver, non-alcoholic fatty liver, and my enzymes and whatever was a mess. And why I was told by liver MDs to stay on Narcs the rest of my life and never allow anyone to tell me different, but many have and some said fatty liver is no big deal. Yet we were “ordered” to do what they demand.

        I had to report to this idiot that no-one forces or threatens me to do anything. I will not sign the special papers, I will not totally forget what doctors and specialist have told me my entire life up to my sixties. And no-one is going to give me orders or “orders” to tell me to take any dope or pills that I know will harm me. Or order me to drive on medications I shouldn’t be driving on, I told him I won’t drive on those meds or a combo of them while the medications is on board in my system. He said oh yes you will. Any time we call you day or night for pill counts and testing. Even if it means driving hundreds of miles.” I said BS.

        Then those scum over there think I am NOT pissed or have a reason to be upset?! Well he said all this crap was coming from the top. Okay, well, from the top down and all these white collar freaks and sociopaths are totally insane and intentionally out to kill us off or see us get into a damn wreck somewhere along the road in winter.

        So at the “new and improved pain clinic” everything was re-done and told to “forget anything any civilian or VA doctor and specialist has told you to this date, forget it all.” He said. That’s how stupid this guy and information was.

        Another odd point I didn’t mention. The so-called counselor was a white guy. All of us vets sitting there were white. From the Nam conflict, Iraq to Afgan wars or conflicts. All told the same stupid stuff.

        WE were told and ordered about the fact the VA would and can force us to take anti-depressants for pain regardless if we had severe side-effects from it in the past. I objected. He said we would all be forced to agree and to sign those special documents and additional agreements so the VA can literally take over our lives in every aspect. Like never using civilian care at all, period. And to bow to their wishes to take meds that damn near killed me in the past and still suffer some uncommon things from it today.

        I have yet to speak to anyone that were told some of the things we were. That is why I wanted an investigation and for them to question others in the groups before it all went down the memory hole, forgotten, or others dying off before a testimony. Or to see is the others are too afraid due to threats to speak up. But the freaks in any office in Indiana refuse to care, pass the buck, or ignore the issues, or say their hands are tied.

      2. T,
        My PCP told me that if I did not sign “her” agreement, then she would not prescribe the pain med. “her agreement” was for me to be weaned by 10 tablets every month until we get down to 60 a month. She told me to inform her when I had reached my pain threshold. I did that early in 2016. It made no difference. She still is continuing to wean. She does not care what I am going through as long as she wens me down to that amount which will not allow me the ability to work.
        I noticed one thing that I have been repeatedly told. “I need to change the way my brain thinks about pain” Why do “I” need to do that? also that is the definition of brainwashing.
        This is from the Oxford dictionaries:
        [with object]
        Make (someone) adopt radically different beliefs by using systematic and often forcible pressure: the organization could brainwash young people they have been brainwashed into conformity and subservience.

        “By using systematic pressure”.
        This is what the VA is trying to make us believe and it is the whole VA doing this. Thus it is a systematic thing.
        “often forcible pressure”
        They are forcing us to “change the way are brain thinks’ This is force. They are forcing us to abide by their ways or else. That is force as well.

        I have told them that I do not need to change the way my brain thinks as it was working and I see no need to change it.

        This is from the dictionary:
        To make people believe only what you want them to believe by continually telling them that it is true and preventing any other information from reaching them:
        Could it be that we’re brainwashed to accept things?

        I believe that we are being brainwashed.

      3. Time for the filling of a lawsuit for thee federal charges of torture and genocide onto the medical ill in physical pain due to medical condition,,,ie,,,denial of effective,timely medical care that causes severe physical pain,,ie death unto a group of people by any government entity,,,,,BOTH TORTURE AND GENOCIDE CARRY A LIFE SENTENCE IN PRISON FOR THAT GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEEE,,,, and appropriately soo,,thus they are putting us into the prison of our own bodies ravage w/physical pain a no medicine to lessen that physical pain,,ie,,,torture ,,,thus having no other means other than to use ,”self termination,” of that body,,to stop thee physical pains,,,maryw

      4. @mary – Please list any cases that sets precedence in this area of law. The reason I ask, some cases have more of an uphill battle than others to win such lawsuits.

      5. f8f, What you are being introduced to is the concept that the Brain Can Heal what ails you by changing the brain itself. Osteopathic = medical care that promotes the body’s ability to heal itself & change how your brain reads pain signals. You are in the study lab for Neuropathic pain.[I dropped out] It’s a must to visit the veterans health library & read all their material that guides them in your ‘treatment’ plan. If reading is not your thing, though I recommend you know what the VA knows, youtube Neuropathic pain. If you ever hear the PC bring up gabapentin… run
        Fight, be angry but in the end, they’re going to take them pills be aware, be prepared, be smarter than the serpent.

      6. NiteWish,
        I am fighting this type of treatment. I am losing but I am fighting. I was getting the reduction in pain by using my previous pain medication dosage. This was a lesser amount than I was previously prescribed. I was making it work but not anymore. I am not one to just “change my brain”. If it is not broke, don’t fix it!
        I put this YouTube video on here a while ago. They used to play this on almost every TV at the Indy VAMC. It was more propaganda they were trying to promote.
        change the (dot) to .
        It was made in Australia and its primary function is to get everyone to believe that if they change their brains, they will all be completely healed. Not!!!
        As far as the gabba, tried it, had an adverse reaction, will not do that again!

      7. Cute video. The deeper meaning of Pain is when you’ve done all that & still there is pain.

      8. Yeah, we are brain-washed and socially engineered from birth. Below are some good people to listen to or read on about.

        Side note; There is another person out there with petitions to “End Predatory Healthcare Pricing.” STEVEN I. WEISSMAN, A Former Hospital President.

        Also columns in the USCAnnenberg Center for Health Information website through University of Southern California website. “Betrayal: Corrupt Congress could fix healthcare with 3 sentences”
        ( Doctors will not reduce their rates for us lousy expendable vets, but thanks for your service crap.)

        He isn’t being liked very much by VA chatter and those in the entire health care fields either.

        Kevin Shipp Episode 692 on the John B Well Youtube. X CIA Truther. Will amazy you.

        Richard Alan Miller. #38 His info comes from years in government to training Seal Teams, high levels of security, and on to the use of drugs, propaganda, censoring, book banning, etc. Sounds goofy but this guy is all over the net and discussing issues the government hates.

        Those are the same weaning tactics used in some smoker cessation classes too. A wean down to this, oh good, we can wean you down to this then, then well try nothing for the magic 3 month period prescribed by the AMA and government freaks that claims to change all negative habits and thinking. Ha!

        Been down that road before too. Over the years I’ve done it all in the VA and outside the VA. Been from here to California trying different things, in-patient programs, clinics, and offers. Done or tried the Tai Chi, hypnosis, Bio-feed back, acupuncture that worked for some things, not all, and very expensive today compared to the hundred bucks it cost in the eighties. Spent countless hours traveling to attend all the chronic pain issue programs, seminars, conventions I could find. Same stuff different day, more money, little help. ( Yet told by some punk at the VA to forget it all.)

        That I agree on too. Force they use. “often forcible pressure”. Like “collective punishment’ it is all supposed to be war crimes. So we are not in a free nation but try telling that to the young and gung-ho bunch or lefties or neocons. Blood test by all except for our leaders and corrupt… is Collective punishment and “force.”

        Just had to accept Smart Meters here by Force*. Told I had to allow it to put on my house. When I called after hearing on the news we didn’t have to I found I was being ‘forced” to accept the meters or pay $100 to put the old meter back on and an extra $38 dollars a month to have the meter read. They don’t trust us to do it but we are supposed to trust them. So one way or another we are forced to accept whatever some money junky or some fascist tyrannical powers that be to accept most things we cannot change or have a voice in. But our politicians and wealthy sure don’t care about us or the cost of anything.

        We go to council and town meetings and all claim to value our freedoms of speech and input. Those commie snowflakes all claim they’d fight to the death for it. Ha, more lies and that include all branches of miltary veterans, all of them. Then smile as they control all information about town. Prevent us from forming groups or putting signs of protest in our yards and go online in chat rooms or forums to suppress and delete whatever doesn’t agree with their agendas or communist lefty lies and propaganda. Oh and by the way, cops here do not use warrants. That crap is only on TV not real life. So we can add jack booted thuggery to the mix since we don’t comply. Living in America? But that is pure fact and truth for Terre Haute the new cultural Marxist college town living under the corrupt. So I doubt any news person who values their career and life will come talk to me about some reality here in Indiana.

        Mary, for law suits I just got ignored, laughed at, no returned calls, or it will take hundreds of thousands of dollars to fight them… if I lived through it. Being the way Indiana handles freedom and truth lovers. The same way for our medical records being filled with lies, or deleted, or communications that would catch them in their lies, tactics and threats were all deleted from my “Secure Messaging.” A nurse told me here well that’s illegal they can’t do that. I said, oh yes they can and will. The VA and local white collar criminals in the “Professional Courtesy” cliques and country clubs or college butt kissers can do whatever they desire. Kill? Who would know since files and records are changed or trashed, replaced. And no-one would want to suffer the fate of a local whistle-blower or to risk life, liberty, limb, or life to help someone out or to report a murder on the surgeons table with the slip of a scalpel into an artery. For which I recently heard some stories of happening mysteriously, but who knows?

        Here, in Indiana, the ones that could bring about change and represent a citizen refuse to. The whole system of things here simply ignore, deny, threaten, then attack by any methods they have fun doing. Here you better be connected or know some one or some group behind you. If not your on your own and vet groups decline to get involved. So I am now done with all them, they had their chances for years. Now to hell with and those on Faux News and other MSM channels too.

        They kill “nuisance animals” here. Birds, pigeons, crows, beavers, etc. Yet they brag about animal rights the lying two faced hypocrites all. Especially the city council and shadow government here. I am a murderer cause I eat meat. I am also called… A ” a two legged nuisance animal.” I am a beast of the field, put in the field, to be destroyed. In the seventies on dealing with the locally corrupt I was merely “a piss ant on the elephants butt about to be squashed.” Or so they thought and threatened.

  15. Full disclosure- I am not veteran and I don’t personally know anyone who has been in combat or otherwise suffered injury or adverse mental effects in service. But I share in everyone’s distrust (or paranoia, though just because we are paranoid doesn’t mean they aren’t out to us) and frustration with the federal government’s insistence to make every part of life difficult, confusing, bureaucratic, expensive, and increasingly under their watch and control. Most of all, I am disturbed and sickened at how veteran’s are being mistreated.
    I am on medicaid, hopefully not for much longer, and I am starting to think vets might get much better care on medicaid than through the VA. Aside from the stigma- because no, I am not lazy nor looking for hand-outs, and yes I am embarrassed- I have been able to see my preferred doctors (the same ones I spent years finding and paid my for my own insurance to see) with out waiting weeks, and have had even less difficulty with my prescriptions than with any of my private insurance. Though I have heard that the VA provides superior care, eventually.
    Perhaps I can allay the fear that the government conspired to get vets addicted to opioids and then take them away as an experiment, well, at least not only on vets. Private doctors are being coerced to withhold opioid prescriptions for sufficient pain management as well. They are forced to report the scripts they write to the DEA, who analyzes them and some how determines whether or not a doctor’s prescribing activities fit in an arbitrary matrix they deem acceptable. And just in case a patient gets a script that the DEA finds objectionable, both the insurance company and pharmacy can prevent the patient from filling a script. And just to add some true government flavor, patients must undergo random drug tests, see the doctor every month for refills- which are limited in strength and number of pills- and undergo treatments that the doctor already know will provide little if any relief.
    Essentially, anyone in need of opioid pain control is immediately suspect and assumed to be abusing and addicted. Keep your meds under lock and key and try not to leave the house with them; because if someone- like a VA nurse or your skeevy cousin- steals your necessary and legitimately obtained medicine, you are screwed. The police will go after you- I know from experience- and you will not be permitted replacement pills.
    If you aren’t getting sufficient pain management, alcohol is a common choice, but far too risky and damaging to to the body for little relief. Marijuana is a far better choice, as far as effectiveness and safety, but vets are usually exempt from state that allow it, through one government tool or another. There is at least one doctor who has been permitted to test marijuana efficacy for pain and PTSD, but red tape will continue to strangle the progress, even once the doc can get suitable quality cannabis. Apparently she can only get it from the government and the gov only grows the shittiest of schwag. There are any number of legitimate cannabis dispensaries with extremely knowledgeable staff that could save years and tons of money spent on this research by guiding the best known strains for treating specific conditions. But that’s government, reinvent the wheel from central commands office. Also, I saw mention of toxicity, and it’s physically impossible to ingest or inhale enough marijuana to be poisoned; please fact check me, you will see that humans can actually die from drinking too much water, but not from overindulging on marijuana. Kratom is also a potential treatment for pain, but I don’t know the risks of taking it with opioids, as it’s often used in place of them.
    And in case anyone is wondering why I am on Disabled Vets .org websit, I am trying to understand the ACA better, as well the full repeal, and possible replacement bills to educate others, including politicians. This led me to read up on electronic health records and the cost burden on providers, and to an article on Politico about VistA published a few days ago, as well as under-reported news that the administrator for the VA is lying about excessive wait times, again.

    1. To ErinJ,,,,,,all 3 of my brother served,,,my father-in- law,,,served and stayed for his entire life,,working 15 in the cia,,then another 15 in DOD,,,To this day,,I remember going to to visit all of them,,,no-one ever smiled in those bases,,,,i think I know why now,,,especially at Quanitco,,,but we all do have CPP IN COMMON,,, jmo,,I am shocked how many on this post are actually being strait up about the complete prejudice,,”witch hunting,” technique our government has used on ALLLL OF US,,, consciderring this site was rite in there w/all Wisconsin Newspapers,,media going spreading thee propaganda off their ,”candy man,” instead of publishing objectively such as,,A young man tragically dies in a psych-ward after hoarding 13 different meds,ie,lieing to his doctors,,and NO-ONE in that psych-ward knew cpr,,thus none was preformed to save his life,,It blew my mind when no-one know/KNEW any of our veterans MEDICAL histories,,yet are the 1st to take away w/propaganda,,’witch-hunting,” thee ONLY MEDICINES that gave them some physical relief of the physical pain from war injuries sustain defending the very freedom,,our government has taken from them,,I HOPE ALL OUR VETS ARE TELLING THEIR SON/DAUGHTER what the government is truly about,,and none of them sign on that line!!!For if they get hurt,,our tax dollars governed by this government,,WILL NOT HELP THEM,,BUT HURT THEM MORE,,,
      Anywho,,,your point of all us getting together is something that NEEDS TO HAPPEN YESTERDAY,,, for it is about get worse for our vets,,then us,,They want more restriction on our medicine,,,nothing past 90 days,,,,essentially destroyer the field of Chronic Pain Management for good,,,70 % have lost their MEDICINE,, along with 22,000 MORE DEATH DUE TO UNTREATED PHYSICAL PAIN,,I did some research for my case,,all death dropped by 4500 from the years between 1990-2000,,,,when Doctors were in charge of our MEDICINES,,since 2001 thru 2016,,,2,000 people a day MORE,, are having to use ,”self termination,” as their only form to stop their physical pain from medical illness/conditions,,,since their MEDICINE has forcible been denied access too thru cdc guidelines,government regulation..
      For all of u,,who doctors have lied to drop u from getting your medicines,,,just a little bit of info on my personal medical issue,,,,72 hours before emergency surgery for pancreatitis,,I was given a ct scann w/contrast,,,according to 3 Doctors,,,ct was normal,,,,48 hours,,next day,,,and echo/ultra sound was done,,showed pancreatitis and a few gall stones,,, Now in actual surgery,,,the surgeon with his OWN EYES,, said ,,”Your gallbladder was completely calcified,look like a gravel pit,,and all your internal organs are badly beaten up,he had to re-open my pancreatic ducts which kept closing due to pancreatitis,,NOW MY POINT IS,, no x-ray,,no ct,,no mri,,,NO ECHO,,,,EVER SHOWED ANY OF THIS FOR 15 YEARS!!!!!!!THEY JUST CALLED ME,,A WOMEN,,A LIER,FAKING IT,,,ALL THEE ,”ARTIFACT;;” MY EKG SHOWED,,THEY BLAMMED ME,,,THEE COLLAPSED LUNGS,,,THEY BLAMMED ME,,,,THE FACT,,THE TRUTH,,,IS/WAS,,THE MEDICAL IMAGERY NOW A DAYS WAS INCAPABLE OF PICKING UP THEE CALCIFICATION OF MY ORGANS,,,WAS INCAPABLE OF SHOWING THE TYPE OF STONES FULL IN MY GALLBLADDER AND LODGING IN MY PANCREAS,,,,,,,Soo for any of u ,,who’s doc comes back and said,,”all test normal,”””’bullsh-t,,,,,,,there are many things these imagery tests do not see,,,all front line basic tests are all 2 D,,,,,,not 3d,,,so a tumor could be hiding behind a organ,,,,,,Again,,my point being,,if u physically feel physical pain,,,there is a physical reason for it,,and just because a doctor chooses not to believe you,,,does not make u a lier,,,it makes them thee lier,,when the truth finally reveals itself,,,and Unless your Doc is willing to go in w/his own eyes,,and not lie,,,,never stop telling the truth about your physical pain!!!mary

      1. MARYW I am sorry for your troubles, be well. I’d like to add how good does it feel to have the PC look into your face & tell you “oh, its not that bad” as if they are all knowing, sensitive & compassionate. NOT!

      2. NiteWish, that happened to me last Mon. at my PCP appointment when I caught her lying. I asked her about my history of my anemia and she said I did have a problem or two with it but nothing serious. I then pulled out the e-mail she sent me when I asked her to please check my iron and ferritin as I was sure it was down again. her response was that “I did not nor have I ever had a history of anemia”. I then produced my two year history from the Puget sound VAMC which started with my admittance to the Puget Sound VAMC ICU due to my critical level of iron and ferritin. My iron was three and my ferritin was eight. My anemia continued up to my first appointment at the Indy VAMC (2012 to 2014). She did not even look at her own history! I then got the stare, and then the deflection and then on to another thing. I love doing that. I left her copies of those and other Puget Sound medical history that she said she would have scanned into the system. It has not been done as of this e-mail. I have more copies and I will continue to deliver them to her until she complies. I try to make things fun (at least for me)

      3. be-aware,,,,there all lieing now a days,,,all of them,,,,,,,,out of fear of loosing there ability to feed there families,,,,isn’t that irony,,,we lost that abilty the day our medicine was taken,,,do u see us cowarding in corners saying yes master??!!!!!!NO F====== WAY,,,mary

    2. You won’t learn about anything much from watching TV or mainstream news, for sure. Try to Google Elaina George MD about Obummer care and “Big Medicine.”

      Watch the entire video one Youtube. “Government & Healthcare – No Money in Prevention! – With Dr. David Janda ” with John B. Wells.

      Read the stories here and around some town and wonder why there is so much cover-up and censoring going on. Or why local and state vet groups refrain from getting involved or would rather be more concerned about a puppy or kitty, or why they all fear some politics.

      I ask around town if all vets are going through the same stuff I and others are. Many say they have no problems getting their pain meds and have had no issues with the VA. But then again they may be dealing with on special clinic or have somehow had a good heart doctor (example) for twenty years and has the balls to not allow the ever changing PCP to rule over them or change aspects in their care. I and others have not been that lucky. Some of those vets not having issues with pain meds don’t have the problems I deal with or the poor guy sitting next to me in the phony orientation that was full of metal head to toe and in plenty of pain but had to play the VA game since so much was wrong with him.

      I’ve talked to other vets that they too left the local CBOC or local VA satellite clinic and said they didn’t have the issues I dealt with but they were sent to one of the best teams at Indy. Or so I hear is one of the best teams.

      “Conspiracy?” Research who and when and why that word started being used by our corrupt government to stifle any secret information coming out. Or to use tactics like PizzaGate to mislead people to make them look like fools for false reporting. Even though there are serious issues about perversion in high places.

      Listen to the video and listen/hear to what the government can and does do to some doctor and others who don’t play their game like with the VA or political corruption. Then think what they have done or can do to people like me who is vocal about wrong doing and corruption that encompasses us, or me, full circle. And why the corrupt media is controlled, bought off, or full-on anti-American propagandist and liars. Well used by our stinking government and so-called leaders, the VA.

      Many moons ago when I was in union affairs and sneaking in meetings locally like with types like MoveOn, communist party, Democrat Socialist, and miany others their rules and games are nasty and brutal. One main point of their used like the VA and the government is…”TO CONFUSE IS TO CONTROL.” Which will or should lead you to anti-American books like Alinsky’s book “Rule for Radicals” and those by Bill Ayers ol’ Obama’s buddy that frequented the White House. Or read the “Communist Manifesto” or the United Nations global initiatives and global war on drugs and prescriptions. Or Agenda 21 or Common Core. While the top get whatever they want and as many heart transplant as they need while others can’t. Like Rockefeller recently, till he died, or how ever it’s spelled.

      But there again I have seen tons of information disappear from the net over the years. Books censored, etc. Just like seemingly there was always a veteran or VA staff that would warn guys about files being flagged for discussing off topic issues like depleted uranium issues or dissing the VA. Hell, were they being just well meaning or put in those classes and waiting rooms to shut people up from having discussions, instilling more fear tactics, or stifle asking questions? Who knows.

    3. Erinj, *I saw mention of toxicity, and it’s physically impossible to ingest or inhale enough marijuana to be poisoned; please fact check me*
      I just want to comment on Symptoms not from cannabis toxicity but on some additives. I am one of the few people who have an irritation/allergic reaction to propylene glycol or the added flavors used to manufacture liquid cannabis vaporizer cartridges; I get some pretty nasty effects when inhaled so I avoid. Cannabis Tincture are processed with high proof grain alcohol & those of us who have overcome alcohol abuse should probably not use that product. SensiChew edibles for insomnia that contain Melatonin cause me to suffer 5hrs worth of dry heaves & bed spins another do not take for me. SensiChew that contain caffeine cause every muscle to contract & restrict for hours until the dose & the sickness wears off. The original cannabis plant is extremely hard to find now that the [cia] gathered all the known varieties from around the world & ‘weaponized’ the plants & set them loose into general population. Some of these strands make me physically sick, its trial & error on dry herb but I’ve found that if I take a good whiff of the dry product & I like the smell, I can take it but if the smell is irritating that variety is a no go for me.

      1. The original cannabis plant is extremely hard to find now that the [cia] gathered all the known varieties from around the world & ‘weaponized’ the plants & set them loose into general population.

        Nitewish, do you have any more info about this?
        How this was done?

        I’ve had my suspicions about some so-called weed myself. It didn’t seem “real” and the effects were irritating rather than medicating.

        CBD oil is made from gmo cannabis plants developed at the U of Minnesota, a long time ago. I’ve wondered whether the pollen from this no-THC gmo frankenweed has been sprayed everywhere.

        All patents and medical studies I’ve read show that high THC + some CBD is the best combo for healing. The crooks in charge push CBD because it is destroying real THC, giving a tiny bit of some relief for some, but no relief for most. It’s another pharma product, in no way related to the cannabis plant. It’s engineered. Just like these plastic wood-look floors are engineered. They are very poor, fake substitute for 3/4″ solid oak floor.

      2. Lawyerlynn, When there are many eyes reading inquiring minds when pondering information seek out answers to unanswered questions outside the box.

  16. Benjamin,

    Would it be possible to get a ‘page Up/Down’ button the mobile version of this blog?

  17. So, what I’m reading here in the comments section is that there is an electrode type device or a couple types out there maybe within the VA…one that is like a head band used to treat migraines? What’s the other one for?
    Oh, I almost forgot, the pain I have (from spinal injuries due to IEDs) makes getting kicked in the balls by a pro soccer player seem like a sensual blowjob by comparison.
    I don’t drink alcohol, I don’t use tobacco, I don’t take Tylenol or other over the counter meds, the only medication I ingest is Tramodal. I prefer to stay focused and “right-minded” so I can Maybe annihilate any threat around me at any time…So, I can see when someone is trying to fuck me over. Besides, with the Super Cool TBIs I have a hard enough time with recalling things on demand…so I figure getting stoned or otherwise intoxicated is going to be a really bad deal for me and possibly for my family.
    (When I got back from Iraq the second time, I hit the bottle hard. I went to many bars on almost daily bar crawls. I didn’t stop drinking until I passed out or was arrested for fighting. Being out my sober mind, made me a very very bad person. Although, it made for good stories after I called the PD later in the week to find out what the hell happened those nights) (with my job at the time I needed to write reports about police contact I had so I needed the ‘official story’ anyway, not what little bits of crap I could remember.)
    Anyway, good morning Vets!

    1. LP heres some info from the gov’t website: One PTSD treatment being tested at VA is transcranial magnetic stimulation, or TMS. It is being combined with an existing therapy, prolonged exposure, in an attempt to enhance & accelerate treatment effects. *The Veteran sits in a chair and thinks about the traumatic event they experienced while they were in the war zone. While that’s happening, magnetic pulses stimulate the part of the brain that allows you to feel in control of a situation…*

      1. would anyone allow the VA to transmit “magntic” waves into their brain?
        cannabis relieves all symptoms of ptsd.
        no need for brain waves if you want to get rid of ptsd.
        VA knows this.
        they will not use cannabis.
        because they know it treats everything with no damaging side effects and you don’t need to include VA or doctors even, if you want.
        anything other than cannabis is more brainwash. imo.

      2. Lawyerlynn, The frequencies of the ‘human’ are known & can be influenced. Nikola Tesla (1856-1943) understood frequency vibrations. They’ve had his inventions 75yrs now & its time to test the control group of Military Human Capital. I would not let them but if they get it right it may well be of therapeutic value.

      3. Hell no! That’s akin to letting the VA *really* go down the Dr. Frankenstein path. Imagine some VA hack deciding to check their Face Book or other social media while the Veteran in in the Magnetic Lobotomy Soup Machine (MLSM), or the VA hack simply ignores the Vet or simply falls asleep while the Veteran’s brain is baking.

        I would hope it would have a ***DING*** like most microwaves do when your dinner is fully cooked because that would surely garner the full attention of the VA Witch Dr. Hack, but then again, when the VA hack realizes it’s not a Hot Pocket Dinner that’s ready for them, makes them angry so they kick the machine up a few notches for another session.

        Hell NO!
        Not the VA or anyone, but especially the VA. I could see those hacks using this device on veterans then placing notes in their file using “Evidence Based Medicine” that the Veteran is improved, so let’s reduce his disability rating…never mind the path of pool of drool behind Veteran as he walks….HELL NO.

      4. Spot on! The day a VA hack tries to “provide me” with that treatment will be a Zero Tolerance 0301 day for them.

      5. I already Am in control. It’s my fucking head. They can stimulate their own brain…sounds like some Nazi doctor shit.

      6. …sounds like some Nazi doctor shit.

        I’m certain that National Socialists (aka “Nationalists”) of Third Reich Germany did not treat their veteran soldiers with disrespect. Those Germans loved their soldiers, and the top brass of Wehrmacht/Third Reich had great respect for their people, all of the people. All families of fallen soldiers were taken care of for life by the Reich. Communists couldn’t stand sovereign Germany, so they put a stop to that. Many of us today believe that nations have a right to exist without foreign/international control, just like the Germans did.

  18. Okay Ben’s world, I am tired and need to pass out. Hope you all sleep well, and God Bless you all.

    1. @cj, glad to see you. Sounds like you had a rough battle today. You will win the war this summer.God Bless you and yours. I hope you sleep peacefully and do great tomorrow in th 70 degree weather we are promised tomorrow. Take care and God speed.

    1. Didn’t mean to post Boooo!……….I decided to NOT post a lengthy rant and that was part of that rant.

  19. I am so tired of the VA using any excuse to take you off your needed pain medication. Do I think the VA cares if you OD, I think not! WHY? I have been fighting for an item I have 3 Letters Of Medical Necessity for, which has been the only proven way I have found not only to cut back on medications, reduce spasticity, reduce pain, it also has helped me build muscle in legs. I have had 2 separate trials, one for 30 days and one for 60 days both with amazing results. This is big since I need a Medication Waiver from DEA, due to being on 240mg’s of Oxycodone, 3 times a day, on top of Valuim, Baclofen, and a number of others due to injury during deployment. All I get is lies from the acting Medical Director of Prescott Arizona VA, Dr. Piatt (who shouldn’t be allowed to be a care giver let alone help Veterans), who has even blatantly lied to Senator McCain and Congressman Gosar, I have proven with paperwork, and have an open OIG Case Number for. Between him and David Blount, head of Physical Therapy, should have their jobs seriously looked at for replacement due to horrible treatment of Veterans.

    1. @Timothy Ramos: Tim, what are these trial you speak of? There are veterans here that are in need of pain control and of getting back their muscle mass. Is it possible for you to post more info on all of this?

    2. @Timothy Ramos – Can you post the name of the pain management trial that you’ve received? Sounds interesting and worth a look over. My VA PCP doesn’t let me know of any current or new pain treatments that may be available. At this point, I’m open for anything that may be promising in achieving good or excellent results. Yours sound very promising. Thank you.

  20. Ben at al, what we have here is a HUGE, and I DO mean HUGE ass law suit, and the conspiracy reaches way beyond the borders of the United States. Allow for me to share this most recent letter with you that I sent to the VA OIG. (Ben, would you care to be involved with representation? contact me).

    Plain and Simple: Its a racket.

    After two decades of dealing with the VA and pain management I have finally been able to sum up the problem in one fall swoop. I am confident that sharing this letter will help to empower many others on this subject. My letter is as follows:

    VA, I would like to share with you about my experience while being a patient under your care for the better part of two and a half decades. My first visit to the VA was at Fresno in 1992. I had noticed some challenges once I discharged in 1991 so I sought out health care. I was prescribed a lifetime of xanax and told to carry on. Starting around 1998 I began witnessing constant pain in my lower legs. The Va would prescribe to me either codeine or Vicodin on an as needed basis. As time went on and the years passed by I eventually would be placed on a regiment of effective pain management through the use of pain meds. By 2005 I was taking 60 5mg of oxycodone per month. My life was functional, my pain was managed, I enjoyed a successful livelihood. By the year 2011 my dosage was at 60 15mg oxycodones per month. Both my doctor and I felt this was the best level for me to be at, I was functional and had lifelyhood.

    It was in 2011 that out of nowhere my doctor began acting out of the ordinary strange as it pertained to my pain management plan. It was as if all of a sudden the pain meds that I was taking, and that had been quite successful, would be abandoned. Abandoned for a healthier approach to managing my pain. Yet we had done all the tests, taken all the therapy, determined all the unknowns concerning the source of the pain, we had agreed and abided by a functional plan that was a success.

    Within weeks of first noticing this strange and sudden anti-opioid behavior coming from my doctor, she would be cutting me completely off of my medicine for no other reason than “her superiors would no longer accept patients taking opioids for pain management”. It cut. This hurt.

    I was sent into a state of shock. Even worse, I’d come to realize that this was my last prescription of a medicine my livelihood and success depended upon. I also understood the ramifications of withdrawing from such medicines and couldn’t bare to think about the pain that would return. It was inevitable that if I did not find a way to attain my necessary pain medicine that my world would come tumbling down. And it did just that.

    In just less than 4 weeks my world went from being highly functional and filled with life, to dysfunctional as death. I And I had no other choice than to sever the good 15+ year long caring relationship I had shared with my doctor. She apparently no longer could care. Policy dictated.

    Of course having no more doctor or even wish to using the VA services it would leave me without health care. This would lead me to fend for finding my medicine on the streets if need be. I was determined I’d stay functional. Prices on the street for such meds as Oxycodones range from .50 cents to $2.00 per mg. So for one 15mg oxycodone you would pay from $8 to $30! Buying my much needed 60 of 15mg per month count would cost over $1000. Not to worry though, there is a cheap, powerful, alternative in the streets they told me. Its called smack, dope, black, horse, H, for heroin. (correct dosage is impossible using H, and incorrect dosage = dysfunctional)

    You know, when I look at the opium production chart for Afghanistan I often times wonder, was this all planned and arranged? Somehow manufactured?

    Note: In 2001 afghan opium production falls to 0%. The Taliban had met with the farmers and told them they were messing up the worlds people, they were messing up their own people, and that such things had no place in their cultural beliefs and religions. The farmers at once halted all production of opium in afghan. But, in late 2001 the Americans show up, and the afghan opium production charts off to the races and follows a massive up-scaling trend that wouldn’t stabilize until nearly two decades later; 2016. Today Afghan provides the world with 98% of its legal and illegal opium.

    Back on point.

    I’m looked down upon by doctors at the VA, policy has driven them to label me an addict. A manufactured addict. Policy dictated.

    I wanted to share my experience with you just in case there might be enough change going around that place that someone might find a way for me to get back on my pain meds, meds that were the difference between having a life, an having no life at all. I sure could use some true care from what I thought the VA once provided. From what I know you once provided me with a great doctor/patient relationship and a plan that worked. I’d like to request a change back to that care I once knew. Do you know a doctor willing to accept this plan? this success? Or will policy dictate?

    US Army

  21. Ah?!?!
    Could this be why that new dr. Of mine just decided to Cut my prescription in half? Like I commented on the last report. Those fucks!

    1. @LP: Nice huh LP? Fucking torturous sick bastards. You did hear they also got a brand new electoshock machine that works by magnetics instead of electrodes? This is at a California VA somewhere, to use on those veterans. The dark ages are making a comeback, Profit making at it’s finest, provide nothing but a massive bill.
      We have imported so many of our enemy to provide care, it is insane.

      1. @cj, is that the SIMS machine that you are talking about? I have heard a little about it.

      2. @Ex va: I don’t know what it is calles, Crazy elf posted a comment about it, or, maybe it was namnibor. I can’t remember who.

      3. @cj, i heard about a headband with electrodes that stops migraines, it is not on the market yet. Also, their is some machine that does act like an electroshock machine too. We are going backwards with treating the brain i think too.

      4. Your dam right cj,,,it is literally the dark ages in Pain control,,,bit on stick,,,It is like the Pennhursts of the days of old,,,,and the poisen pens of Propaganda via the media have been these arrogant ass’s tool for spreading this opiatephobia VERY WELLLL!!!!!!its like thee 1930’s reefer madness commercials to keep the dea employed now a days w/the media,,,If I could find a lawyer to prosecute the Federal Government,or any government employee for thee willful act of torture and genocide onto our vets and CPP’S,,, i would do it in heart beat for both federal crimes of torture and genocide carry a life sentence appropriately,,maryw

  22. The VA and Indiana scum are claiming the same victories then… a decrease in pain meds. Whoopie!!! Oh, but certain others can attain what ever they need in their special cliques and social status. Just like doctors and the wealthy getting those special signed documents so they, their friends, family, etc., don’t have to be forced to take required vaccinations that is forced on the rest of the population.

    My last visit to the “new pain clinic” I was told by the MD that I needed to remain on pain meds which my new foreigner female cocky PCP refused to do. Said she had orders to cut her patients in half that were on pain meds whether or not they were needed. And then she tuned out to be a real lying, tormenting, game playing scum bag. Major game player.

    Been without pain meds now for about two years and quality of life is in the dumps. For years, even before the VA system I was given the standard two types of pain meds and for migraines. One lower dose of Oxy or Hydos for the lesser pain, and two types for ‘break through pain’ and migraine. The VA cut me from time released morphine to only Hydrocodone 10. Liver clinic told me to never take anything over the counter or stuff with Tylenol again, to stay on narcs. But that all changed too. I was told not to go what I was told in the past and the PCP doesn’t have to treat us by what specialty clinics MDs report to do.

    After a bad fall messing my hips up and tearing rotator cuffs, plus torn muscles they say nothing can be done (too old for surgeries) and by state law civilian MDs cannot give me my normal pain meds either. The medical boards tell them they can lose their license by not doing as told by the state fascist. So they can claim their bragging rights along with law enforcement about how great their anti doping laws are.

    Civilian care in Indiana isn’t much better than the VA today. Plenty of BS, waiting up to six hours for my last pain pill of Hydro filled, but had to sit in a waiting room with my body going to hell on me, and spine disks popping out of place for SIX damn hours. Over two hours for the next visit and I had to leave I got so sick waiting for over two hour then. The room packed with patients still in the evening with a new secretary shift coming on, and I was not about to wait any longer to play the game, or to sign the crazy forms they demanded I sign to be seen. Really crazy stuff. No to mention the same old game with my new hospital clinic PCP that can’t do anything but cost me more money and tell me to go see another specialist to take the same test and X-rays again.

    I have nothing but pure hell trying to get good care here to now avail. Plenty of cocky attitudes and being told no for pain meds and to go back to the VA. Which I will not do. I have zero trust in the health care idustry today and none at all at the VA. More so whenever I hear more horror stories locally that are being hushed, people too afraid to talk to strangers about issues, and from local retaliation.

    The POS highly trained idiot that gave us our ‘new pain clinic’ orientation was threatening, abusive, mean, cruel. a total asshole, bragging. seemingly a psychopath, pathological liar, stuffed in a pathological super ego with no concern for others feelings at all.

    I have wrote about it before. And I have tried every person in the state to get an investigation going but nothing happens. The idiot counselor told us if we didn’t like the new VA way to hit the streets to buy some dope, go back to drinking, be forced to sign those new contracts with the VA, or go die and do without. Real nice person he was for being “one of the best highly trained VA drug counselors in the state and at the VA. What BS, this stuff makes my blood boil. Then all the scum here claim we are all alike and none of us is to be trusted???

    Vets said they had good luck with Kratom for pain. By the time I heard about that Indiana scum made it illegal too along with acupuncture needles we could get for simple treatment. And the fascist will not allow anything that works be legal here as it may be in third world countries or in some forest but not in tyrant and corrupt land called Indiana.

    For years I passed blood test with flying colors. No extreme usage of meds, all clean and clear, over two hundred and some blood tests and some very sneaky testing with more in one days time, no abuse, zero alcohol, never. But then some would show totally clean then accused of selling my meds which I did not do, so the new changes said we had to have the full script dosages in our system 24/7/365 non stop. Which is also BS. Point being “NONE OF US ARE CAPABLE OF BEING RESPONSIBLE FOR OUR OWN NEEDS AND OVER-SEEING OUR NARCOTICS AND PRESCRIPTIONS.” “YOU ARE ALL ALIKE, PERIOD.”

    I better cease cause my BP and shaking is through the roof. There is plenty to report and write but it’s all the same intentional game playing and to make us suffer. Especially those of us who may have had to transer care from a corrupt CBOC to the Indy hospital which turned out being far worse with more intentional abuse and harm than what I and some others left from. What a damn mess. But the scum at the top think this is all funny stuff like the cops do along with the politicians and media bragging about doing such fine jobs fighting the dope issue.

    I am pain head to foot/toes. Still not over the VA breaking my jaw two years ago and still picking bone chips out of my inner gums, and can’t wear the dentures a civilian dentist made for me. TMJ and migraines vastly increased, jaw joints so swelled I had to bend my eye glasses out far enough to fit a foot ball and the jokers here stay silent, lose files, smile, won’t help, while I am forced to practically live in bed or in the house. Everybody and anybody I talk to here is in full protection mode to cover for all the scum and professional classes, civy and VA trash. Not fun when your alone in the world fighting this shit with something new poping up daily or dealing with intentional retaliation and threats full circle from the bottom to the top in DC. Wow…………sorry for the rant, I gotta go get sick. I am going to go public and when I do I will post my facebook page here, like it or not because some aspects of life I am not PC or traditional on. But those are sied issus. ………………

    1. T, I have no love for the Allopathic or Osteopathic educated at Gandhi Medical College so called medical doctors. I’ve never hated any person the way I hate the doctor assigned to me, & its not even so much she canceled my meds, its more the disrespectful attitude & lies she wrote in the VA Notes about me. I also was told to “go elsewhere” if you don’t like your treatment.

    2. T
      I know exactly what you are talking about. The Indy VAMC is so full of people who think they are so much better than everyone else.
      I went to the pain clinic and they said they would not take away our narcotic pain meds but when you meet with them one on one, it was a completely different story. My PCP went with Mary Crawford’s bull and lies and did not believe one word I said.
      I was then sent to a Pain pharmacist. I asked about this because of my pain clinic experience and my PCP told me this was completely different. It was different. It was worse than the pain clinic. Kelly Franks-Henderson was on a mission to make me out to be a drug addict. She took things out of context, made things up, and outright lied on things about me. She tried to make it appear that I was high during the appointment by claiming I had large pupils that were covered by dark contacts which were covering my naturally blue eyes. I do not have blue eyes, I have brown eyes. How can you get that wrong?? She even put in a “disruptive patient” note in my records because according to her, I verbally abused her. But I did not do it once or twice, according to her this continued for the next 90 minutes. Who in the hell would allow being abused in any way for 90 minutes? She could have ended the appointment at any time if this was happening but she did not. The disruptive patient note was found to be without merit. The problem is that it is in my permanent record and nothing in it states that it was unfounded. That is in the third set of medical records. There is a third set of medical records people. This is the set that is seen from Dr. To Dr. No one outside of the provider will ever see these. They can contain any information, any derogatory remarks, any type of name calling, ETC… I have some proof of this by someone in at the Roudebush VAMC. They do exist.
      Tina Hewitt-White Patient advocate will do nothing to help. She just give some “I can’t do anything about this” excuse.
      On another note, I and some other vets are having our medical records looked at by a private dr. (who does not like the VA). This is being done by a reporter from fox59 news. She has been working on this for a few months. The private Dr. has said he cannot believe what is in our records. If the reporter can continue with this story, it may help those of us who legitimately need these. If you would like, I could give you the reporters name and you can see if that reporter would include you in this. You would have to be willing to on TV and tell your story. I am all for it.
      I do believe this I why I am getting even worse treatment now. I think I am getting some retaliation.

      1. So, you have been right in the mouths of the Eskenazi Medical Center right next to the Indy VAMC? Have heard some eerie stories. Weird relationship with all the other major Univ. Medical Colleges….that Indy VAMC must be staffed with oodles of baby fat wearing residents playing Dr. ?

      2. @figure8fan – Please post the contact information of this brave physician. If you know it, include DEA and or State License Number for where they practice. Seems like someone in the private sector has some nads. If this physician pans out, I want to encourage others to participate as well. Don’t worry, if you’ve complained about the VA before or raised your voice in a VA facility, more than likely you’re already on their stupid dam lists; Disruptive Behavior, EPER’s.

        If this physician is just, I’m not waiting for our so-called caring elected politicians. They are slowly loosing their base, and don’t even want to recognize it. Yeppers, once they get elected, many of them forget.

      3. ANutterVet,
        Let me contact the reporter from fox59 and run it by that reporter. I do not want to risk what we have going on now.
        I did find this on he physician’s Website:
        Clinical Interests
        Pain, Opioid Use in Pain Management, Acupuncture, Integrative Approach to Pain Care
        If the reporter says it would be OK, then I will. If not then I will have to wait until the story runs or gets cancelled by the VAMC or the State. This state is very good about keeping anything that is bad about vets out of the news. I am going to see if he is accepting new patients. He already has some info on me.
        I will let you know

      4. @figure8fan – Hey, if this is in any way shape or form connected to the VA, I’m out. I don’t trust any of them. I’ve laid my heart on their table enough, only to have it trampled upon. Plus, I don’t trust my reactions at this point due to the VA not caring about my family members. They’ve crossed the visible line. So, if it is all cleared out of VA people, I’m all in for it. If I smell their rats ass, I’m out. Then once the doc checks out, I’m game.

        I don’t know if you’ve read any of my previous posts, some are spot on, others are of the sicko nature, but I’m an Investigative Research Biologist. I’m really tired of the VA fluffobese [ANutterVets pseudo word] hair balls defiling good scientific practices and principles. Thanx

      5. Yeah, I am up again and still. Trying to recuperate from my rant and memories from earlier posting.

        Fig8? Beware of anything in Indiana and I do mean anything and anybody that claims to be like the VA or government. You know, like “we are here to help,” or “we will tell your story and some truth.” I’ve been down that road before in Indiana and ending up not trusting any news media here, then having a Fed court brief just lost including all my original evidence and not a thing to be done about it. Especially since Indiana has always been filled with those at the top and corrupt all around in those symbiotic relationships of evil, greed, lies, cover-ups, to protect them all and anyone connected to them.

        If you try to expose pedophiles or open homosexuals out in the parks doing their thing so as to the point we, or I, could not take a grand kid to the parks to see such crap means trouble and retaliation from the locals, media, activist, college crowd, and local councils who claim such stuff is in their rule books not to be discussed.

        For example. During my years of volunteer work, years with addicts, rehab groups, etc. I dealt with and cornored many pedos who were supported and protected by the local cliques, media, and etc. I sat with a nurse who was paid off to never mentioned what happened to her 14yr old son by a 70 something year old pedo or she couldn’t afford to finish med school. The pedo told me once since I had to work around him and see what those kind of people do and how protected they are…he said…”you’d be surprised how many people like me there are in town and in Indiana. High level very well connected and respected folks you don’t want to mess with or run afoul of.” Unquote. Then hear about it being rampant in Washington DC like the sex trade but like the VA and all the professional misconduct here goes protected and out of the news. Reasons such as I have gone through, the evil and perversions here, plus corrupt courts, and whatever they do to people like me is never heard of.

        If anyone thinks I’m kidding go to the the only forum we have here now called Terre Haute Topix and see all the censoring going on and sick crap they allow to remain on the forum. That too is visited by and protected by, censorship supported by local council people and the down town uppity cliques who will do anything to keep Indiana or this town’s image seem clean but it rots from within, fully. And is why I cannot attend town meetings or have any voice at all here due to the retaliation, threats, and legal malevolence they want to put on me or anyone who disagrees with them or any of the corrupt which includes the VA, oral surgeons, attorney general, councils. all lawyers, secretive organizations/clubs, all the state agencies, medical boards, media, and on and on it goes to no end. When I got my first divorce and seeing my attorney at my X-wife’s to be house fooling around, then him dropping me as a client and taking her wasn’t misconduct enough still for the local BAR, or the phony watchers of the Supreme Court of Indiana. Then we think some medical board will help us with medical or VA misconduct, abuse, malpractice or intentional psy-ops or other crap to destroy us one way or the other. Especially to people like me who will not bow down or assimilate to all their crap. The entire state is crooked, corrupt, connected, and protect every evil aspect of this pretend to be free state. Truth, even in the courts and media is not allowed here. Nor in colleges or towns like this run by MoveOn members and the Cultural Marxist crowd or college lefties who run things. So beware. I have been fooled more than once due to my desperation and needs which just led me deeper in to the root of it all leaving me totally hopeless and no hopes for humankind or trust there-in. More so when stinking VA staff tell us for better care to vote for Hillary, a neocon or some communist out there. While spouting about their SEIU and union flyers that used to hang in the VA hospital and elevators till I guess they finally took them down.

        We can’t even get Indy news here any longer since they stopped the state news here in both cable and sats. Just the same reasons why they stopped VA having actual physical meeting groups minus the teleconferencing crap due to too much sharing of negative VA news/personal experiences, and us learning and hearing too much. Which was told to me by a tech who quit working at the local CBOC.

        As a union safety and health officer some thirty years ago I tried some of those news interviews dealing with severe environmental issues to worker’s deaths to all the corruption and not a one was ever shown and then completely denied when the pay-offs and “professional courtesies” began with them to protect the mighty state of Indiana. Today the corruption and cover-ups are worse and better connected complete with all the various forms of retaliation, threats, to not having the same rights or protections that others have in the grand thing called community.

        Pardon me while I have to just deal with the pain and cramps and burning nerve bolts as I will just jump around to where my mind goes. I have papers I was to sign from the new civy pain clinic MD that stated some info between doctors were and could be totally private. Just as someone stated about MDs not having to disclose comments or remarks from the inner offices or health care center to another. And that MDs today can sue a patient for not taking their meds as directed! We don’t live in the old America today under a Constitution.

        I haven’t played on facebook enough to know how to use it but here I am and with extended family that can’t help me or too far away and have their own problems. But I am at the end of the line and my rope. They can’t do me anymore damage or threaten as they all already have. And am I supposed to fear them all like those on my city council and others demand or desire? Ha, not I. Let them come and do their worse cause I’ve about been through it all and seen more than enough. I will take a lie detect test will any of them including the VA creeps, local doctors, or any of the local council creeps and censors at the media? Nope. So I’ll play. Then stay tuned for the fun and info and hate. One against a hundred thousand or so aren’t that bad of odds. “No weapon formed against me shall prosper.” Isaiah. And besides, even in death we are censored since I told the cemetery I didn’t want any VA tombstone. If they wont’ take care of us now alive then I don’t want a damn thing from them dead. Plus, I am censored there too since I can’t put a curse on my tombstone for Indiana, Terrible Haute and all the treasonous corrupt bastards, females too, that support the criminal elements here that have it all and get it all. Pretty sad we can’t have a last hoest word on the stones since that too has to be PC and pleasing to the Luciderian worshippers playing their game of facade all around the state and in every office and position IMHO.

      6. I don’t see my FB site here. Maybe it shows up for others or it goes to Ben. If so get it from Ben. I’ll stick my neck out again it doesn’t matter to me. Done it all my life so might as well end it the same way. I am really so sick of people being afraid of this government, the VA, dirty lawyers, corrupt courts, political scum, activist, and the threats. To hell with them all.

        @BEN, whoever wants my FB page give it to them. I’ll play middle man and I hope I can disgrace and show what Indiana is really like and how lame and evil our media is.

  23. fingers not working well today so please forgive improper caps and lack of most punctuation

    wow just wow probably the most brilliant article I have read in the last year thanks for sharing with us a bit of your upbringing ben

    j c weatherby who authored that article and published it on medium is pathetically misinformed to the point of stupidity i have attended services at evangelical churches and found those churches to contain some of the most openminded people I have ever met in my life

    weatherby apparently does not realize that when you say evangelical church you are referring to a very specific denomination of the christian religion instead he just throws all denominations in the pot stirs the mix and out comes evangelical stew wrong on so many levels his comparison of proper evangelicals to the taliban is laughable at best unfortunately it will most likely cause quite a bit of damage suffice to say he would fit right in with the crop of administrative big wig folks running the va

    on to the opioid reduction plan politics plain and simple I will save my story for commenting sunday or when I see the poll appear fingers done for the day brothers and sisters time for some non va prescribed pills and cbd vape gotta lower the pain a few notches

  24. Originally, I found this blog, looking for answers. In the beginning, I found many Veterans who have at least one thing in common: We are all angry. It appears that we’ve been battered by the VA for months, years, decades. I may have Stockholm Syndrome. I’m in on class action lawsuit against the VA, alleging violations against Veterans’ rights. How long has this crap been going on? Looks like everywhere I look, another memorandum replaces Rights, and breaks laws. Resulting in the needless deaths of Veterans, another chain attached to tragedy. Original point, I now have more questions. Rant out

  25. @Cj, I can only guess, your appointment went, came with surprises. Just to get home unscathed, without scathing anyone else, is a good thing. The VA actually gets off on the suffering of one Veteran, let alone all the Veterans they get to see in pain. Then you get this smug and insulting look…, the look I always see. That look that causes feelings of less than. There’s nothing I can do. Without first hand knowledge, it’s like a sex crime was committed by the VA, if I tell, they won’t like me anymore. I dislike dealing with the VA, as it is.

    1. THAT *look* has a name but it takes two words for the VA’s variety: Indifference & Disdain. While giving a crocodile grin but no tear.

      1. @Namnibor – They’re incapable of tearing, until it happens to one of them or their love ones. The dam bloated toads. Plus, they need to morph from a croc to a another species of animal. Hmm, may be human.

      2. “bloated toads”…LMAO! Crossed with a sloth and sewer rat. Highly evolved mutants from Darwin’s basement experiments that got away and got loose in the swamp.

        Speaking of swamps. I see the congress critters tried at the last minute to push it to a vote after removing from the new healthcare law: AMBULANCE RIDES. I KID YOU NOT. The rat bastards somehow thought in a healthcare insurance plan covered ambulance rides for emergencies…oh…and ER VISITS were hacked from covered…WTF? Luckily, it did not make it to a vote because there were also a bunch of other things cut almost like someone went down a last while walking down the hall holding a sharpie marker and randomly marking off things to try to appeal to the Dino Critters, and do not forget about the Koch Brothers….but somehow with all this flurry, Veterans and The VA Swamp seems forgotten and the Swamp is gurgling more so than ever with apparently such a massive blast from it’s intestinal past, D.C. is no longer safe with an open flame for miles.

        I think the VA and OIG and VA Pubic and Public Affairs are taking full advantage of the smokescreen over Russia and Healthcare to slowly try to release an elongated silent but very deadly fart of VA scandal…wait for it…

        The critters are playing a chess game of time….what are they trying to stave-off?


      3. @Namnibor – In reality, they are really, Ch-ch-ch-ch-choking on the Ch-ch-ch-changes. An unnatural gag reflex due to overstuffing their epical orifice. Stuffed with what? I’ll let your mind wonder a bit. Hint; backyard bar-b-q.

  26. Thats great, now i have to pay %25 of m y retirement to a priv. Dr. to send me to a Pain managment center.
    you wont find that any place in my records. I did give them to my VA PCP. its all a joke. what is the number for vets now drinking or taking street drugs or suicide? what about house bounds and depressed?

    1. Hell of a lot more than the 16,000 a YEAR that supposedly will ON on Heroin that was somehow a abused NARCOTIC PRESCRIPTION drug… That Heroin is a Schedule ONE as in NO MEDICAL USE doesn’t seem to disqualify Heroin OD’s as “Adverse effects” from PRESCRIPTION NARCOTICS

  27. I haven’t slept prostate in a bed for over a month. Every time I lay down – fetal or on my back – I’m good for 20 minutes and the full spinal contractions kick my ass. I sleep in my Stressless recliner. Still, I need some rest. I can gobble less painkillers except NSAIDs (which fragged my esophagus) and muscle relaxants to no avail. Tramadol, carisoprodol, tylenol.. fuckitall. I drove 3.5 hours to ER – ask for something stronger – nope, gotta wait to see my PCP. Top it all off, my claims were all just denied – never even got a Comp and Pen meeting. Just the fucking finger. I’m tired of the pain, tired of the nightmares, tired of group and counseling, tired of getting sucked into the VA maelstrom, tired of not sleeping, tired GOP and DEM extremism, and like Lilly Von Stupf in Blazing Saddles, I’m tired of being tired. I’m at the point of saying fuck it all and walking away from all things VA and getting on with my life, or, get on with the alternative.

    1. @Windguy- ‘Blazing Saddles’, “I’m Tired”, sung by Madelyn Kahn, by Mel Brooks:

      “[Here I stand, the goddess of Desire

      Set men on fire

      I have this power

      Morning noon and night it’s drink and dancing

      Some quick romancing

      And then a shower

      Stage door johnnies always surround me

      They always hound me

      With one request

      Who can satisfy their lustful habits

      I’m not a rabbit

      I need some rest

      I’m tired

      Sick and tired of love

      I’ve had my fill of love

      From below and above

      Tired, tired of being admired

      Tired of love uninspired

      Let’s face it

      I’m tired

      I’ve been with 1000’s of men

      Again and again

      They promise the moon

      They always coming and going

      Going and coming

      And always too soon

      Right girls?

      I’m tired,

      Tired of playing the game

      Ain’t it a crying shame

      I’m so tired

      God dammit I’m exhausted

      Tired, tired of playing the game

      Ain’t it a crying shame

      I’m so tired


      She’s tired (She’s tired)

      Sick and tired of love (Give her a break)

      She’s had her fill of love (She’s not a snake)

      From bellow and above (Can’t you see she’s sick)

      Tired (She’s bushed)

      Tired of being admired (Let her alone)

      Tired of love uninspired (Get off the phone)

      She’s tired (Don’t you know she’s pooped)

      I’ve been with 1000’s of men

      Again and again

      They sing the same tune

      They start with Byron and Shelly

      And jump on your belly

      And bust your ballon


      Tired, tired of playing the game

      Ain’t it a freakin’ shame

      I’m so…

      Let’s face it everything below the waist is kapput!



    2. @Windguy: Truly sorry about the denials. Don’t let those basards win. YOU are the warrior, not those pansey asses. The alternative you talk of is final, never a good choice. How the hell are YOU going to kick THEIR, asses if your not here to do so? You know enough from my comments, that I am on your side. Pain killers have never helped my pain, nothing has ever helped my pain. I am just lucky enough, that I have been living with this for so many years, it has just become normal to me. I wish you were at that same place. I can tell you from experience, the body has a way of taking care of itself. Worse thing for bad back pain is heat. Some days I spend the entire day on a large ziplock filled with ice. It sounds barbaric, and maybe it is, the point is, try everything until you find something that works for you. It may end up being the craziest thing in the world that works, you just need to keep on keeping on. I hope you know I am not making ight of your situation or trying to downplay it in any way, just trying to help a brother.

      1. I use the Lidocaine patch 5% for my back. I tend to use it more because I am trying to not use my knees. My PCP prescribed these for my knees. I still have no idea how you are to place a 4 in by 6 in patch on your knees for 24 hours and expect it to stay. I put one of those down on my lower center of my back and the relief is almost instant. I have hundreds of these things that I will not use but my PCP told me to continue to use them even after I told her they were not helping.

      2. Believe it or not the Lidocain patches are not local. You can slap one on anywhere and it will allegedly help your knee. Should say that on the box, or google away (I refuse to recommend calling the tele-care phones answered by one person that has a vague idea what they are talking about and 10 who are clueless and need you to be fluent in Taglog)

      3. J.
        I put them on right above my knees and under my braces. They did help a little in the beginning but it did not continue. I stopped them for a week and I could not tell any difference. I restarted them and again nothing. I was hopeful at first because I know that I will have to find something to help as my narcotic pain med will be reduced to nothing.
        Nitewish commented on the topical cannabis healing lotion working. If it would not show up in the dreaded drug screen, I would give it a shot. When my med get so low, I will try it. I will have nothing to lose then.

      4. figure8fan, I don’t know if the lotion will test you positive but you can buy your own drug tests from a place like “” for $1.95 each & they ship fast. I too would like to know if the lotion will give a dirty test but I smoke it too so I know I’m not clean.

      5. thanks for the info. I have been fighting these assholes for so long and I would really hate to give them any ammo to help their side. I will look into this as I will need something soon to help and then I will not give a crap about what they say.

      6. @Nitewish , @figure8fan – If you’re doing cannabis, you may want to try pure isolate CBD crystals under your tongue. Or, you may want to smoke CBD oil with a vaporizer. Also, try to keep you stress as low as possible. Possibly supplement with Melatonin, 5 HTP, L-Tryptophan, GABA, B-2, L-Taurine, TMG, Omega 3 Fish Oil, and Magnesium. And, you may want to consider adding Over-the-Counter [OTC] Benedryl, or some other form of antihistamine to possibly help you to sleep, calm down, or to take the edge off.

        NOTE; The above comment is not medical, nootropic, or supplemental advice. Check with your Primary Care Physician for clearance before taking any chemical compound [that is if they are truly on top of the subjects previously mentioned]. Good luck. ANutterVet

  28. Hello guys,
    I have been reading Ben’s blog even though I have not replied to anything. I have been busy fighting the VA. Some of you know my history and my fights with the VAMC. I am still doing it. I had an appointment Mon. with my PCP who told me she was going to continue to wean me down to 60 5mg Hydrocodone a month. I asked her what was she going to use to help with the increase in pain. Her response, she was not going to give me anything.
    I have tried over 20 non narcotic pain medications over the last 13 years. I have had cortisone injections, simvisc injections, and therapies too numerous to mention. I was seen at the Puget Sound VAMC Pain Clinic after everything else was tried. They prescribed the narcotic pain med. They prescribed MS contin. They sent me to the University of Washington Pain Clinic and they agreed with the Puget Sound VAMC treatment plan.
    I move back to IN and the Roudebush VAMC refused to look at the Puget Sound VAMC medical history and therefore, I am not considered a “druggie” because they will not recognize the non-narcotic pain medications I have tried. I cannot take NSAIDS due to the VAMC prescribing them to me at such a high dosage and for such a long time that my GI tract is now junk. The Roudebush VAMC stopped my narcotic pain med when I returned to IN. No weaning, just took it away. This caused me to become homeless as I could not do anything but cry in pain. I finally got my Psychiatrist to find someone to prescribe me Hydrocodone. It did not help as much as the ms contin but it allowed me the ability to rise above homelessness. I still have a job I love, I have my own housing, and money in the bank.
    This will now be taken away from me due to the weaning. I was told by my PCP that my Puget Sound medical history was irrelevant and she would not use it. I caught her in several lies during the appointment which I proved to her she lied by showing her the e-mails she had sent me. She had me talk to a “patient advocate” which I found out later was someone from the patient response team. I asked her specifically if this person was a real patient advocate and she said yes. She lied to my face. The so called Patient advocate also told me that because they had evaluated me, the Puget Sound medical history did not matter. The problem was that when the Roudebush VAMC did not use the Puget Sound VAMC medical history on any of my first evaluations, x-rays, MRI’s and CT scans. It states “comparison none” No one will listen to me. The real Patient Advocate stated there was nothing she could do.
    The Roudebush VAMC pain clinic was nothing but lies. In the orientation, that made it clear that they were not going to take away anybodies narcotic pain medication, only to help manage it. When I went to the one on one appointment, the first thing that Mary Crawford (pain nurse) told me that she was going to take away my narcotic pain medication and put me on NSAIDS. I told her I could not take NSAIDS and she said that was her decision and if I did not want to take NSAIDS, that was up to me.
    I was then sent to the Pain Pharmacist who made it a point to make me out to be a drug addict. This is a PHARMACIST, someone who should look at patient previous medications if she is supposed to make a treatment plan. In her notes, it states none when asked about previous medications. She tried to make it appear as if I was high during the appointment by stating that I had very large pupils with contacts covering my naturally blue eyes. I do not have blue eyes, I have brown eyes. I was born with brown eyes. No contacts at all, I cannot wear them.
    Sorry this is long but for those who do not know my history, now you do. If you did not want to know my history, then why did you read down to this point? I am kidding.
    I also have something that I sent to Ben in reference to a bill trying to be passed by the Veterans Service organizations. If I read this right, they supposedly want to help homeless veterans. The problem is that they want to take lottery money in the amount of $125,000 a year to help with the veterans. Buried in this bill is a part in which the service officers will get a salary for doing this. There is no amount listed for the salary. The requirement for getting the salary is to work 1,000 hours. That equates to 20 hours a week. It also does not state that they have to be working on homeless veterans to receive this salary. They also have an account nestled in the “fund” that will not be subject to the same accountability rules as the fund. It can contain any amount of the $125,000 and can be used for the salaries, or for whatever they want to use it for.
    It is Indiana Senate Bill 517. It is passing but nothing has been said about the salaries. The Service organizations have someone who deals with homeless veterans. HVAF is a VA funded organization which does the same thing the service organizations are claiming they want to do I was through HVAF when I was homeless). They are paid a salary for the work they do and now they will get two salaries.
    Also to “change the way the brain thinks about pain” is brainwashing.

    1. @f8f- Good to see you are at least giving them a hell of a fight and good to see you again. Did you finally gain some semblance of independence in your life since? Indy?

      1. Hell no! I am still fighting that freaking place. The more I try the deeper it gets. My PCP seems to get a lot of secure e-mails from me lately. I do believe that I am now getting some retaliation due to the fact that I have been in contact with the local news and the reporter is trying to get this crap out in the light. There are several of us vets who have sent her our latest medical records to be gone over by a private doctor. This doctor is no fan of the VA and so far he claims he cannot believe what he has read in some of our medical records. The reporter has been getting stonewalled by the VAMC after she put in for a FOI. They keep playing games with her and that is delaying the story.
        I was doing so good since my homelessness. The job I have I love. I am working 50 hours a week now as we are behind. When we are slow, they want us to keep out hours to around 42 hours. So they do not care if we get overtime even when we have nothing to do. We get a bonus at Christmas. My apartment is great, I love the location. I was really being active, and doing everything my PCP had asked me to do on my part. That was all just a lie as she had already decided what was going to happen.
        I did sign a paper to agree to be weaned by 10 tablets a month. I had no choice. It was the lesser of two evils. She told me Mon. that if had not signed the paper she would not have prescribed the narcotic pain medication. Show would have weaned me at a much faster rate and I would most likely not be here anymore. I am so afraid of the future as I will have pain that will be like some of you have already had. I did deal with it earlier and I am not sure I can go through that again.

  29. This video, from “Project Veritas” is from: June 4, 2015 (9:28 min. long).
    It’s a Hidden Camera operation vs VHA’s Pain Management Opioid Addiction Treatment!
    Some of y’all may not have seen it. It’s worth googling and watching.

    “Hidden Camera: VA Director Says VA Turning Veterans into Drug Addicts”

    These “undercover videos” are a wake-up call to everyone! I have a strong feeling it’s also occurring at civilian healthcare systems as well!

  30. It was a political experiment. Tylenol #3 was not even on the original list yet my prescription was stopped suddenly. The number of Veterans needing appts for the Pain Clinics made it impossible & aggravating to get “timely” follow up treatment. I have not benefited but declined.

  31. Taking away pain medications from Veterans who suffer from chronic pain issues is nothing less than being unnecessarily cruel to another human being. Do they believe Veterans or anyone for that matter wants to feel the effects of severe pain? It is negligence, it is not helping someone with their long term suffering. Veterans are trying to survive their injuries, disease and illnesses and need pain management to ease their suffering.

    They want to punish and torture us Veterans as per normal business operations. I guess the term to use would be under a research or an initiative program. What are the goals of this initiative? Just to take away pain medications? To take away beneficial medications to someone who needs it to survive their chronic pain issues?

    We all know that they can be addictive, but some people have no choice but to take pain medication to cut down their chronic pain levels to function. They have to take pain medication to be able to walk and do basic daily living activities for themselves. If you are suffering in pain because you are now cut off pain medications what are you to do? You will probably be bed ridden or in a wheel chair because you cannot stand or walk because of the intensity of the pain. What kinda life do they think a person lives with severe chronic pain??? I can tell you it isn’t much of a life. It is limitations on living and most of the time you cannot just enjoy your life.

  32. Oh I would just love to share with you what happened today, only problem with that is I know for a fact the VA monitors this blog. If I were to tell you of the uttere BS I was subjected to today, it would be as good as signing my real name to this blog, and I will not give those ASSHOLES the satisfaction. It has everything to do with today’s topic, but obviously it is nothing that hasn’t been discussed by the rest of you already. ANutterVet, wait for it……………here it comes……………HEY VA…………..GO FUCK YOURSELF:

    ……..(‘(…´…´…. ¯~/’…’)
    ……….”…\………. _.·´

    Yeah baby………….that felt ohhhh so goooood!!!!!!

  33. The entire anti-opioid campaign is an attempt by the DEA to have pain patients either become one of the ILLEGAL USE STATISTICS by denying them access to LEGAL pain control so they can justify their existence or a way to force chronic pain sufferers into just committing suicide. We are MUCH cheaper on the budget if we are DEAD after all. As far as the VA, yeah, get the pill doctors out, but people that will insist that someone that has been on STABLE Narcotic treatment for many years MUST come off ANY PAIN CONTROL before they will even see them? Especially when even a cursory look would show that the patient had been through EVERY AVAILABLE TREATMENT option over a 9 years BEFORE they finally had to admit that no, it was NOT going to get better, EVER and that they just needed to come to peace with THAT. Unfortunately due to some should be pretty obvious actors Vet’s are much more likely to NEED serious pain management so they can have any quality of life at all than civilians will.
    The so called “Drug War” has been as effective as any other prohibition has in history. It has resulted in types and levels of organized crime that would never have started without it, and now will be basically impossible to get rid of. It has resulted in having the highest rate of incarceration in the world. Destruction of entire families and generations…. And so on. I personally look on it as the VA yet again trying to get out of providing proper medical support to veterans, this time under the guise “saving us from the evils of drugs” Drugs that in my case are the difference between waking up literally screaming or being able to at least get out of bed and feed my livestock.
    As far as the religious issues that since it IS your site you are allowed to toss in here. Look around from a NON-Evagelical or even non-Christian view. You claim that YOU are not out there harassing AF Cadets, Jews, any non-christian/non-Evangelical DOMINONEST out there… trying to get the bible taught as SCIENCE… Fine, just like the Muslims will have to be who finally puts paid to the Jihadist movement, the Evangelicals need to rein in THESE problem children… I seem to recall that the last actual Academy Grad to serve as President, who for some reason active duty types hated and preferred a b grade movie actor over, WAS an honest to g$d evangelical Christian, re-born, some close relative a preacher and frankly simply to GOOD of a Human Being to make a good President to say nothing of being the first elected President post Watergate. Compare THAT, a TRUE Christian, to the mouthing of words but not the walk that the shrub did all the while claiming that he was an Evangelical Christian. Which is it Are Evangelicals simply to good of HUMANS to be the arse-holes that President requires, or can they bold face LIE to the single most trusted Military Man since Ike about the existence of all sorts of evil that just wasn’t there to con the country and the world into a completely unjustified or even successful and completely un-necassery war… And we will not even get into the Dominion “Movement” that is literally PRAYING for Armageddon to start so hey can personally rule alongside Jesus? Which are you when YOU look in the mirror?

  34. As an example of brainwash mind control propaganda, notice this one statement within the patent …

    “Nonpsychoactive cannabinoids, such as cannabidoil, are particularly advantageous to use because they avoid toxicity that is encountered with psychoactive cannabinoids at high doses useful in the method of the present invention.”

    This patent is for psychoactive and non. All research points to high THC as being most effective, but the problem is getting so stoned. Yes, it can be problem on several levels. But the wording here is what is curious.

    Because they use the word “toxicity”. When they talk about cannabis being “toxic”, do you know what they mean? I didn’t. Now I do. It means “getting high” or stoned. That’s the only toxicity associated with cannabis. It doesn’t cause any damage, and some people love the feeling of “high” and some can’t work or manage while they are high at the therapeutic dose. So, yes, it can be a problem, but they call it


    washing brains. washing brains. washing brains.

    Designed to make people think “toxic at high (therapeutic) doses”. Alot of people believe toxic at any dose, which may be right, but not harmful. newspeak is tricky. love and irie to all. bless up.

    1. Lawyerlynn, I was pleasantly surprised how well topical cannabis healing lotion worked on the muscle spasms in my neck. Well worth the $20 a small bottle cost.

      1. Might be the best muscle relaxer yet.
        If you got highgrade flowers you can cook in coconut or castor oil,
        then use that for a rub. save $$. diy??
        Not too much oil, just cover the flowers. make strong, can dilute if needed.
        won’t need.

        it will also pull edema from deep tissue if you keep rubbing the oil on.

        all these wounds soldiers get, have edema buildup around the internal tissue due to bad blood flow, scarring, inflammation, oxidation, etc. if you can get the water (edema) away from the tissue and to the surface it will evaporate away or you can wipe away too.

        should help you sleep when you don’t have pills if they cutting sleep aids off too.

        live up!

  35. Because of some kind of mind control brainwash, most people don’t know that cannabis was the major part of medical formulary ever since. In written and unwritten history.

    Cannabis is/was used for everything from surgery anesthetic (called “cannabis narcosis”) to pain relief to hormone adjustment, well, everything really.

    If you don’t believe me, take a quick glimpse at the united states patent introduction below. You will see that cannabis prevents, treats and cures, these 3 things:
    1. inflammation
    2. blockages, and
    3. oxidative stress.


    everything is caused by one of those 3 above. If you’re injured, it stops pain, and stops damage by controlling inflammation.

    Just as one example, If you have brain stress (oxidative stress is the term for what happens in the brain when it’s stressed by physical or other trauma) then cannabinoids stop the stress reaction and actually help nerves regenerate. That’s why the Israeli army issues cannabis cigs to all military, who if they get injured or trauma, smoke reefer and stop the “excitotoxin cascade” that causes brain damage, aka PTSD, TBI, and all symptoms associated therewith.

    Think about that. Stops damage from ptsd, tbi, stroke (blockage). Prevents. It also treats the symptoms, but not only treating symptoms, but helping actually fix the problem (nerve regeneration, decrease inflammation increase blood flow to capillaries, clears blockages from bad blood flow, releases dopamine and binds to glutamate, etc.).

    So if cannabis can decrease symptoms and help towards healing, would longterm, high dose cannabis use cure ptsd? tbi? stroke damage? we don’t know because we, lowly veterans, do not have access to research. Israelis do, though.

    That’s how we know, almost 20 years later, about this.

    The VA will get you hooked on opioids, then take them away, and not even tell you that you can get full pain relief as well as ptsd, tbi and stroke symptoms treated by using cannabis.

    You can sleep through the night without nightmares. You can stop seizures. You can stop anxiety. You can cure cancer, blocked arteries and heart disease. You can lower blood pressure. You can stop infection. [This paragraph could go on and on and on.]

    But you can’t. Because one group has taken control of the plant, monopolized all research, as well as ruining the lives (prison) of anyone who dares to use/grow/study the plant.

    While the VA and veterans could stand up and demand this plant, they won’t do it. They continue to lie and it’s just wrong to let people suffer.

    if the VA finds out you use cannabis. They will call you a drug abuser.
    Here’s the intro to one of thousands of cannabis patents.

    US Patent & Trademark Office, Patent Full Text and Image Database]
    ( 1 of 1 )
    United States Patent 6,630,507
    Hampson , et al. October 7, 2003
    Cannabinoids as antioxidants and neuroprotectants


    Cannabinoids have been found to have antioxidant properties, unrelated to NMDA receptor antagonism. This new found property makes cannabinoids useful in the treatment and prophylaxis of wide variety of oxidation associated diseases, such as ischemic, age-related, inflammatory and autoimmune diseases. The cannabinoids are found to have particular application as neuroprotectants, for example in limiting neurological damage following ischemic insults, such as stroke and trauma, or in the treatment of neurodegenerative diseases, such as Alzheimer’s disease, Parkinson’s disease and HIV dementia. Nonpsychoactive cannabinoids, such as cannabidoil, are particularly advantageous to use because they avoid toxicity that is encountered with psychoactive cannabinoids at high doses useful in the method of the present invention. A particular disclosed class of cannabinoids useful as neuroprotective antioxidants is formula (I) wherein the R group is independently selected from the group consisting of H, CH.sub.3, and COCH.sub.3. ##STR1##
    Inventors: Hampson; Aidan J. (Irvine, CA), Axelrod; Julius (Rockville, MD), Grimaldi; Maurizio (Bethesda, MD)
    Assignee: The United States of America as represented by the Department of Health and Human Services (Washington, DC)
    Appl. No.: 09/674,028
    Filed: February 2, 2001
    PCT Filed: April 21, 1999
    PCT No.: PCT/US99/08769
    PCT Pub. No.: WO99/53917
    PCT Pub. Date: October 28, 1999

    1. And I’ve never heard of someone being physically addicted to marijuana. Experimented with it in the 1960s and never had a hang over. Take that to mean physical addition is not in the cards for marijuana as it is for alcohol and opioids. Never took enough opioids to get a hangover but have seen some individuals with one.

  36. When VA terminated the morphine and hydrocodone I was prescribed, I went to my long time local doc that I had not seen for a long time. When she saw the doses that VA had been prescribing she said simply, “I will not take part in this dangerous experiment.”

    It blew my mind and forever changed my view about what I had been doing to my body. I doubt that ANY sane doc outside of VA would prescribe ANYWHERE near the doses of opiates and opiods that VA did. This was before the scandal about how much opiate the VA was prescribing.

    She described what they were doing as a “…dangerous experiment.” but I know that is bullshit. It was no experiement at all. They were prescribing huge doses of the white poison to shut people up. My own VA shrink lamented after they had terminated the morphine for me, “…this took us (the mental health folks) by surpirse too. Previously stable patients are now in trouble…” She meant that previously zoned out mental health patients could no longer be legally sedated by them and as a result had “decompensated” to the point of overloading the mental health staff.

    I was on 160 mg per day morphine and 40 mg per day hydrocodone. This was set up without myself EVER seeing the doc who started it and was done by entering a false pain contract that I never saw nor signed into my health record. I did indeed decompensate when it was completely terminated. When the VA PCP doc stopped prescribing from the phoney pain contract, my own VA shrink began prescribing off of his VA secure prescription drug tablet – not traceable. I had to pay for them then myself but I still got he poison because VA made it possible. My docs entry into my record to describe his decision to begin prescribing morphine when the PCP stopped was, “…I fear the patient will decompensate.” He meant he was afraid I would wake up. He was right. Eventually even he was ordered to cease prescribing from his secure tablet. Since VA did not supply the drugs but only prescribed this way there is no knowing who is still prescribing, right? VA can really only track what they send. Furthermore after I went to police about being provided drugs by VA on the street corner they searched the mental healh building. I obtained by accident the police report of the search by asking for all records with my name mentioned. Amazingly they sent the results of their search of VA mental health.

    The doctor who was involved with dispensing drugs on the corner was found to have a secure VA presciption drug tablet (the only kind that can presribe opiates) in her purse. In theory these tablets are kept under lock and key. She had it in her purse (and a WHOLE BUNCH of other drugs in her office too).

    Make ZERO mistake here; VA knowingly engaged in what the non VA doc called a “…dangerous experiment…” in order to stabilize my own mental health plus my bet is thousands upon thousands of others are or were treated the same- and the simple reason; because we shut up and die and go away.

    Let us cut to the chase here – VA was to kill us with quality of life and we all laid down happily in the poppy fields and said, “Fuck the Yellow Brick Road, this is more cozy.”

    There is no quality in a life that chains you to a pill bottle and trading heart beats in return for a happy couch locked life is truly insane. The VA celebrates that they have terminated this dangerous experiement? Yay for them. Real doctors never went down that path in the first place.

    1. TRUTH&Fact= ,,,it is literally impossible for YOU,, to physically feel the physical pain of anyone,,,its a fact,,,LIKE IT OR NOT,,,IT IS A TRUTH,,, thus,,,,,why do u think u have a rite to decide who suffers in physical pain and who does not,,,,,,with your opinion??????For the flip side of your opinion is,,,,let ’em all suffer,,for YOU believe,,,,,there is no quality of life,,,,I disagree,,,,i believe a truth,a fact,,,,that it not my place,,,to decide who suffers in physical pain and who does not,,I believe since no-one can factually truthfully feel the physical pain of another,,NO-ONE has the rite to torture another living soul,,it a private decision,,and we should have the freedom as ADULTS,, to decide our effective MEDICINES,,,for it is FACTUALLY,, truthfully,,,impossible,,for me to physically feel the physical pain of another,,Soo who the hell am I,,,,,to tell them,,,like u,,,,TO SUFFER IN PHYSICAL PAIN FROM A MEDICAL ILLNESS,,, with my opinion,,,for that is,,the true flip side,,,of your opinion,,mary

      1. It is pretty tough to sell me on the idea that widespread opiate addiction benefits even a single soul. It is not tough to convince me of the iron grip that opiates and opiods has on your soul.

        I understand the meaning of pain my friend, likely in profound and ongoing ways that most will never enjoy. This is my own lot in life.

        My point is that pain is a part of life and when you take it all away then you have taken away a part of life. As a bonus the actual end of life as an opiate user is generally excrutiatingly painful when it plays out until the end.

        I guess it comes down to this; are you afraid to suffer? I have some REALLY bad news about life if you are…

      2. Hell, you can’t even remember your own pain enough to feel it. That is part of the “empathy problem” even by those who have experienced the same condition.

      3. To Dennis,,,NOT YOUR PLACE,, to decide who suffers in physical pain from medical illneess,, is not your place!!U and sooo many others know nothing about peoples medical histories and u think u have the rite to make them suffer???why???why is there no ability for u in your head,to see there are some thing we humans don’t have a rite to decide,,,,torture is one of them as a so-called humane civilized society,,For I believe how we treat others in this life,,will determine my place in the next,,,I feel/remember my physical pain every second of the day,,,,,,,I will not go into specifics,,but thru a bunch of doctors errors,,being a women,,,if u have ever had a collapsed lung,,where i can’t breath,eat,or ever sleep w/out physical pain,,,thats my physical [pain,,,ever second of the day,,,,NO-ONE has the rite to force physical pain on me,,or anyone else ,,,,,it defined as torture by the U.N to deny anyone proper effective ,timely ,medical treatment in which that denial will cause severe physical pain,,,it is defined as TORTURE,,,again carrying a life sentence for any government employee guilty of propaganda,collusion,or out-rite denial of access to medicines to reduce physical pain from medical conditions,,,,maryw

      4. Mary, Mirror-touch synesthesia involves an individual physically feeling what they observe happening to another person. As an example: When you see someone hit their hand with a hammer the same areas light up in your brain as they do in the other brain. We all have Mirror Neurons, the brain is a fascinating organ.

      5. Mary,

        My post was about opiates and opiate addiction facilitated and promoted by the government of The United States of America. My own attempts at self inflating my lung while I simultaneously attempted meditation to cope with a leg and knee that had been shattered also left an impact on my soul. How could it not? When I too found my death scream and my mind filled with the blue white electric pain that God yanked up out of my spine something inside changed forever. I live that moment unbidden over and over like the other life moments reaponsible for the PTSD diagnosis I carry.

        That particular night that my bones all got broke up was a game changer heaped on top of a life of game changers. The difference is that I have decided there are two things that simply never actually help anyone. There are two things that we use as needed but are best used only as I might use toilet paper. Those two things are government and pills.

        Both of those served me very well a few years ago as I lay bleeding to death and pinned down by a shattered body. The government sent an ambulance to scrape me up, and the morphine that night, I am told, made it tolerable to the point that my heart did not stop beating. Could have fooled me!

        Now the question becomes, when I got “lifed on” that night did it beat me? It only beats me when I toss in the towel, right? Fate is a hunter and it never stops seeking me, but I am not going to ask the godamn VA to save my life and I did not live through all of this bullshit so far just to end up a stupified couch potato. Just ask yourself, do you REALLY want VA to be your drug dealer? What has that gotten 22 vets per day in America?

        I see posts wondering how many will die without morphine. This is bullshit. Tell me please, throughout history; when has morphine EVER been associated with life? When has morphine EVER led to ANYTHING but cruel suffering when it is easy to get? If you honestly believe that VA is a place of healing and that it is a right fine good idea to put the federal government in charge of dispensing morphine, then it appears that the only things you and I have in common is the common experience of being human.

        I did not become a United States Marine so I could get my opium fix. I did not serve honorably in The Oregon Army National Guard so I could hang out with government folks. I did those things to serve something bigger than me, and I served honorably.

        Last I checked my morphine pills were pretty small, and when I was taking them I sure didn’t brag about it. Beyond that I have no idea at all what my place is in life.

      6. The difference between us Dennis,,I see my MEDICINE AS MEDICINE,,, just a diabetic see insulin,,or a heart patient see nitro,,,for functioning,,for not being in forced physical pain is a basic human right,,,,,,You seee my medicine as some demon drug,,,,,again everyone has a opinion,,,but when your opinion physically hurts someone w/ a medical reason for physical pain by not allowing them MEDICINE to lessen that physical pain,,,then it is part of the propaganda,,,the ,”witch hunt” on us,,our doctors and our MEDICINE,,,,Furthermore,,religiously,,I believe the great creature put these plants here for a reason,,,,,,For he/she too,,, had no intention of forcing human beings to suffer in physical pain,,,I see them as a medicine,,,You see them as some demonizing drug,,,I feel since it is literally impossible for me to physical feel the physical pain of another,,then its not my place to force someone to suffer in [ physical pain,i see that as inhumane,,,thats our difference,,I realize that somethings are the right to freedom as adults to choose,,in a free country,,to choose for themselves,,freedom to choose the proper effective MEDICAL care for your own body is a freedom i have no place denying in a free country as a adult,,,,,,thats are differences,,mary

    2. Those are high doses. All I ever needed was a couple Hydro 10 with Tylenol per day and not every day. Plus time released Morph 30mg for migraines, severe burning nerve pain that felt like i was on fire, spinal disks out of place, etc. I can deal with pain well too but there are breaking points. Too severe would go to the emergency room for shots and play their high priced game. In the past they would give me a high enough dose to ease the pain, sometimes not if some quack was too worried about the dosages I needed to end the pain or ease it up. Too much or too little if I wasn’t listened to came with more severe ‘rebound pain.’ That is if they weren’t injecting me with sterile water so some hospital thief could get their fix. Been down that road too.

      At least on those that used to be considered small amount I could function a lot better and get a small garden in. Without, I fall from nerve pain and joints not lining up, and small projects never get completed because of it and severe cramps. So I don’t do much but gain weight. Had to stop Tai Chi for arthritis from the pain and imbalance issue I have. Eighty year old men and women were doing better than me at 65. So a couple of trainers told me I needed to stop and get the pain under control and do what I can at home to set my own pace and sit when I needed to sit. And how I need to be seated.

      This is a tough complex subject to discuss and deal with. Bottom line is freedom, having choice or voice in our own health care or not. Then on to personal responsibility when dealing with double-edged swords that cut both ways. Then on to why the government lies so much, censors so much that makes research and knowing some fact really dfficult to cut through all the propaganda and stats that we are supposed to believe. Especially since we have all been lied to, socially engineered, brain-washed, mis-led from birth. Oh! We must believe everything on TV, from the FDA, the VA, all those misguiding statistic from just who and why? Like watching ‘Reefer Madness” or something. That is one great movie to see some fine propaganda.

      Look up a Dr. Richard Alan Miller and have a read about his drug experiences and knowledge. Even though he does sound strange he is loaded with non-mainstream information. He was also in high government circles. He will also discuss just why the government is so fearful of people using spiritually focused healing plants of all kinds.

      Also, MDMA by many years ago was claimed a medical break-through but some of it could cause highs like a Mescaline or LSD or something. Then the government comes in and raids the scientist and college profs who was having a big success using what the gov claimed to be “dope.”

      It’s like a book I once read which is banned now and can’t find it or remember the title properly: Of a priest that came to early Americas in the north with sailors dying from many things including cancers to scurvy. He found the American Indiana there had fantastic cures as well as odd ways. He learned from them and took herbs and cures back with him to Europe to show the church, healing people and sailors along the way. What happened back in those days circa 1600 or 1500s? The priest was killed for witchcraft and the herbs and concoctions destroyed that were claimed to heal everything from scurvy, VD, various illnesses I can’t remember right now to cures for what we know today as various forms of cancer and mental instability. So it’s all about control and keeping people ignorant so others can rule over our lives to destroying us. Forgot the name of the more modern concoction that the government destroyed a more modern doctor over for healing some cancer with a famous blend of herbs. It worked so well his head nurse took over letting people know the recipe and herbs used. So why all the fear , propaganda, attacks on freedom, and for most thinking others have the right to tell us how to live or how to cure ourselves? That alone makes about as much sense as instead of home visits like the old days from MDs then going to dragging very ill people to some crowed office to spread the disease or illnesses to all others. Never did make sense to me. Especially when I remember the days of house calls and having one of the best Black doctors from India I ever met. One smart cookie that didn’t quit his house calls until the medical groups forced him to so he could stay in practice in our fascist state of America ruled by greed and controls and Draconian practices. Probably why most times I would come home from the VA feeling sick and later have a horrible cold or flu bug of some kind. Regardless of how many times I washed my mitts or used hand sanitizer in my vehicle before coming home.

      So we can’t through the “baby out with the bathwater” that seems to happen so much in today’s so-called “civilization,” or is that forced socialized or Draconian communitarianism built on communism where we all all alike as stated by many and at the VA. Living under our real Constitution gives us a individual empower republic with individuals being protected from mob rule or mass rule which democracy really is, mob rule over individuals rights and freedoms. Besides our way of democratic voting processes.

      1. Dennis. There are other not so commonly points to consider. One being the lies we are told and more propaganda on TV and by law enforcement. First I should say I have many many years of being in volunteer work, recovery circles in and out of state facilities or nut hospitals. I have also sit and waited with dying friends and patients waiting for end of life pain meds that would come too late. Not fun to watch

        Every kid, crook, thug, criminal knows that adolescents, and many adults, can get off easy just by saying they used dope and that caused them to kill or commit crime. Why? They get a lighter sentence if drugs or alcohol is used or blamed for a criminal event. So the stats go up to appease the governments agenda. Much like the “Devil made me do it.” No, not being aware of the consequences did it. Being prone to criminality did it. The VA told out group that we “Vets are all alike and will become criminals at some point.” No, wrong, that is my CHOICE and would be high or straight. Though booze can make us more pliant to being nuts and shameful things. If they have the propensity for rape, murder, thefts they are going to do it anyway at some point, no stopping them. Like not being able to stop a serious suicide. TV and news also puts stupid stuff into young minds too.

        Those well paid actors and grieving widows on TV associated with the anti-pain pill movement is also more propaganda. I know and heard of plenty of people who committed suicide leaving notes behind and family aware of it all, but reporting it as a “accidental over-dose. ” Bull, “take one pill with food every 4 to 6 hours then eating the whole bottle or two, plus a full bottle of 100 proof vodka doesn’t equate to any damned “accidental over-dose.” If claims are made of suicide most insurance companies will not pay off. So the family has to make a hard decision. Play the game, increase the phony statistics, for money over the loss or report the incident factually rather than get paid again for a commercial while weeping and blaming it all on a pill to pacify our leading crooks, or, drinking while on some medication. You should know urban and psycho warfare better than me. And there are plenty of people writing books and trying to tell the American people they are all being used, played, and propagandized to the end.

        Another point is the power it gives the state. Like UN-Constitutional civil forfeiture. That means its more about greed, and more power. More bodies for non violent crimes because some vet gets caught smoking a J then losing every thing they worked for their entire lives and may face life imprisonment for such a small thing. Because they didn’t want to play the power and greed game or wanted to self medicate with some herb that the Bible says “is good.” So that shines a different light on our 501c3 propagandizing lying churches or the far right of things too doesn’t it?

        I gotta move again but the answer to the issues isn’t well know about, or reported on by our state controlled and censored media. Most don’t give these other issues a second thought. They just fall for, or believe everything they here in town or see on TV, or lied about by some quack MD or crooked scientist to achieve their own agendas. Much like them all merely following Agenda 21 and the United Nation’s so-called global war on drugs, among other things, that just robs us all of our rights and freedoms. There is plenty of information out there to read about it all to chew on.

        But who will listen to those of us who refuse to “toe the line” and assimilate with the Zombies, gubbermint, activist, big Pharma, greedy, FDA, CDC jokers, or with all the other Borg out there. There is always more to the official narratives and stories we are supposed to gulp down just by knee-jerk reactions and not wanting to look deeper into things. or be easily turned away from seeking some truth or experience of others.

        Have a good night.

      2. When the Puget Sound VAMC Pain Clinic decided to prescribe me narcotics, They prescribed MS contin 10mg three times a day. This was increased to 15mg three times a day. This was done after 13 years of non-narcotic pain meds (20), cortisone injections, simvisc injections, numerous physical therapies, metal braces, cane, ortho consults, University of Washington Pain Clinic, arthroscopic surgery, topical creams, Ibuprofen (which has turned my GI tract to junk) acetaminophen, Hrdros, and percs. The MS contin worked and I was able to have some quality of life. I was able to get through a day without having my pain becoming a stopping point. It was nice.
        I move back to Indiana and my MS Contin was abruptly stopped by Dr. Prashanthi Bolla, after Dr. Eromonsele Idahosa prescribed the MS Contin but at a different dosage. I could not find anyone who was willing to look at the Puget Sound VAMC medical history to see that I was not a “drug addict”, as I am now labeled. I was finally prescribed Hydrocodone by Dr. Lynch at two 5mg three times a day. He later threatened to take those away. He sent me to the Pain clinic who would not look at my previous medical history. My PCP change sent me to Dr. Vidyasree Atluri. She could not do anything on her own. She completely relied on whatever anyone else would tell her. She agreed with the biased recommendation from the pain clinic and was going to take me completely off of the Hydros and she prescribed acetaminophen and topical cream (the fifth prescription for this). I was the switched to Dr. Abhinav Singh. I did not see him as I was switched to my current PCP Dr. Meetu Golla.
        She is claiming that I am taking too many Hydros and is going to wean me down to 60 5mg tablets a month. I get nothing else to help with the pain. I asked her at my appointment if she was weaning me because of the amount and she said no, it was because of the new VA procedures. I had talked to someone she told me was the purple team’s patient advocate who informed me that I am taking too many Hydros a month and that is the reason for the wean. They could not get their stories straight.
        But according to my current PCP I am taking 110 five mg Hydros for this month and that is too much. Not because I do not need it, but because they think it is too many tablets a month. My pain, my quality of life, my livelihood, and my sanity, ETC… have no bearing. The pill amount per month is what matters. Sixty 5mg tablets a month will not work. That is two a day. These do not last 12 hours. What am I to do for the half a day I am getting no release. I always thought that you were supposed to take the Hydros before that pain got to high and that way you were able to better control it. This way will not allow me to stay ahead of the pain. Stupid Roudebush VAMC.
        I will continue to fight these morons as it is a personal thing.

      3. Golla is a two faced lying piece of crap like the rest of the Purple Team game players. For months I waited and ran around trying to get consults that I had for many years at the VA. The Purple scum would tell me the consults were in, then I’d go to the clinics because I wasn’t getting an appointment date and they said like others… there has been NO consult from your team or MD. Odd, so I played the game on the phone and on foot to no avail for months. Finally when I had my fill of all the games over there the new Purple Teams Patient Advocate which I didn’t know each team had them, told me, oh I see they had the consults in months ago then laughed. Then got nasty with me.

        When the first PA called me at home wanting to know what my problems were I told him. Also about the name calling behind my back and remarks from some clinic supporters in the waiting rooms peanut gallery. I would just look back and laugh cause I am not stupid enough to get into a racial brawl or argue on VA turf or anywhere else for that matter. Then all the harassment started and more when I first found Ben’s site here and posted using my real name which I will do now for you to use with your reporter. Someone has to stop Indiana’s and the VA’s deeply embedded BS and corruption games. And for someone to group up to fight all the censoring, fears, and everyone else s ” hands are tied” or “not wanting to get involved because of attacks and politics” crap.

        The first PA calling me was more interested in telling me how great Golla the ho was or is. For many minutes and how wrong I was about things and how great the team was, how great Dr. Howard was, and that nobody there would treat me badly and on it went playing the cheerleader game. Then he went off when I told him about some “Fat loud-mouth” or someone behind me called me names. He went off. “Nobody talks about my team that way bub” and on he went. It all was a well planned game cause some things just went far beyond mere consequences. I wasn’t supposed to mention being told what to do, the change in all my prescriptions and special lotions etc. From a MD that openly told me ” I didn’t have time to read your file.” (!!)

        She also told me the new pain clinic crap was voluntary. So as usual I agreed to go listen to more so-called VA’s best experts. Turned out the male counselor we had said it all is mandatory as well as signing a special contract that allowed the VA to call us in at any time of day to never use civilian care for anything like I have said before, and it basically takes control over every aspect of our lives. Plus the crap about them being the greatest and well trained…. and in great part rules and controls all of Indiana’s health care systems along with the kiddies and commies at IU and other medical schools and boards. It was really all quite beyond being insane and nonsensical. But breaking my jaw during oral surgery to pull a molar for denture took the cake.

        I went back for the dental check-up and all seemed well as they said but like a nice little sheep I didn’t mention much about the swelling and pain. We big tough white men aren’t supposed to do such things. I also didn’t complain when they popped my TMJ problems I warned them about. So there was that added pain on of the rest plus the mess they left my neck in, on top of migraine causing. But they wouldn’t care anyway.

        I haven’t opened my last file request trying to find out who that scum-bag was at our pain clinic orientation was because of the upset and blood pressure upset. But that ass needs firing or to lose his retirement which he has done by now, retired or put back a state mental hospital where they found him. During the orin class he bragged about being there 18 and a know it all while we were basically plumb stupid.

        I have never been out of line at any visit. Never missed a appointment but a few and they were notified in advance. The only time I ever raised my voice was in the parking lot over a cop putting no parking cones around my car because a bus couldn’t park there, giving me a ticket. That was resolved cause I went up and demanded to see the lot’s video of what I was supposed to do. It didn’t exist and they took the ticket back. It was one thing after another for years so enough is enough.

        IN the pain clinic orientation my voice was raised of course and had to speak up and ask questions because others there seemed too afraid to speak up for fear of losing their care. So to heck with that. Being talked to worse than dogs along with threats? No way. I wasn’t yelling either, just a simple raised voice and clear. Probably about a 70 or 75 on the DB scale. Normal is about 60-65 maybe.

        I wish you better luck than I had, and have. It seems in my town where cliques and thuggery is rampant and health care creeps support each other, and do whatever they can to cover-up for the VA, I am done. I have made many many more enemies just for simply speaking some truth and contacting all the various people and politicians or boards where we are supposed to get help from. Not here. So there is my name and hit me up on FaceBook and I’ll get back on there for a while and play. Let the games begin again, or continue on. And I hope this crap does nation wide and puts a spot-light on this very sick and corrupt state of Indiana and our very corrupt medical boards, media, the censoring, the games, down to the well protected scum-bag communist unions. From what I have done through alone, not counting all other stories, I cannot ever again trust in this states health care or any so-called “Professionals.”

        Yeah, I’ll talk to a reporter and I bet they run from the truth and out of fear of their positions and job, will fail or refuse to report much about the VA or the state’s corruption and “Professional Courtesies” to save face and the facade of good reputation. I’ve talked to so-called college professors about some matters like oath taking and truth. Students and them alike believe in censoring, ignoring real news and corruption. And believe truth and people like me needs “suppressed and over-come.” Over come means to “destroy” in activist code.

        Be well, and let the games go on.

      4. Tryon, My real name is Randy. I am at the point that it does not matter, I am sure anyone who wants to know me or about me does so. I use the figure8fan due to I used to be heavily into the racing at the Speedrome in Indy. I was a crew chief for a late model team. It was some of the best times of my life.
        I am so glad you know golla. I could not agree with you more. She has made it a point lately to put my secure e-mails in my records. She puts in anything that makes her appear to be great and anything she can that makes me look bad. She will only put in part of the chain of e-mails after I have proved her wrong. Those parts never seem to make it in.
        I am fighting my consult she put in because she listed my left knee only. She knows that it should be both knees. She did this to delay the care. I have sent her an e-mail in which I was not nice and told her how stupid she is. Now I have to wait longer. She is currently refusing to directly answer nay of my e-mails. Her answer to anything now is as follows:
        As I mentioned, I have placed an Ortho consult. We will wait for those recommendations for continuing plan of care.
        Have a good day,
        Dr. Golla

        I do not get any help just that answer. I also talked to someone that she states was the purple team’s patient advocate. His name was Alan Smith. I called the Roudebush VAMC the next day ans asked to speak with the purple team’s patient advocate and I was told there is no such person. I was told there is a person in the patient response center who is like the head of the response team but he does not have that title. golla looked me right in the eye and lied to me.
        He tried to play the game of “I think I have talked to you a couple of times”. I have never talked to him. Then he tried to lay it on thick about how good things are and how happy I should be because I have an updated evaluations which will work better for me and my care. The evaluation part is true, the bad part is it was an evaluation which was biased and NONE of my Puget Sound medical history was included. When I continued to have a good answer for his BS he finally got up and left. He did not even tell me to have a good day. Just got up and left. He was a young guy who looked as if he had just gotten out of college and was trying out what he had learned in psychology.
        I am waiting on a response from the reporter on giving the name of the doctor who is looking at our records. I will give it a couple of days and call. I look forward to the State of Indiana and/or the VA to shut this down if the actual proof is going to be made public.
        In my latest note golla made it appear as if I am refusing to go to the pain clinic. She did not put anything in the notes to state that I had already been through the pain clinic. She did put in part of my comment about the pain clinic being on a witch hunt and how all they want to do is take away everyone’s legitimate need for the pain meds.
        I then asked for another appointment to continue to discuss my pain and I was told by her that we had an appointment to discuss this and she did not see what advantage could be had by having another appointment. I told her by doing that she was refusing me care. She had some BS answer and then stated that she would have someone contact me in a few days. A few days. I have not gotten that call and I have waited on hold so long trying to request an appointment with no luck. I have and will continue to e-mail asking for the next available appointment. By asking for the appointment in an e-mail, I have proof that I have done so and that I am being ignored.
        I have also informed her that I have stopped all of my medications with the exception of my pain med which life would not exist without it. The best part was when I asked about how my labs were and my blood pressure was. She told me how great my readings were. I asked her if I should continue with what I was doing. She said by all means, continue. That is when I let her know that I had stopped all of those meds. My readings were actually better than when I was taking the meds. I have never had that good of a blood pressure reading. She really did not like that.
        I will ask the reporter if anyone can be included now. If so I will contact you.
        I wish there was some way to mass inform the civilian population of the actual VA and how it actually works. In our current world, everyone is so connected, that they do not have any type of memory. The need for a memory is no longer a part of the human brain. If we need to know something we simply google it. I think this is the reason things are like they are now. No one can remember what has happened six months ago. I remember in school, we had to learn the history of this country and now it can be brought up on your phone. Short term and long term memory is now like having an eight track tape player.

      5. U know it would of help us ALLLL,,, if doctors had the BALLS,, to write the truth,,,,,”’that truth being,,,”Since the Government interference of medical care/decision of Adult private citizens,,,and the Government practicing medicine w/out a liscence AND IN FEAR OF THE GOVERNMENT[DEA] TAKING MY LISCENCE ,THUS THEE ABILITY TO FEED MY FAMILY AS A Doctor,, I can no longer treat this patient w/the medicine he needs to survive in lessen physical pain!!!but NOOOOOOOOOO,,, THEY ALL COWARD IN CORNER AND WILLFULLY blame us!!!!!!
        Here a stat for us all,,,,from 1990-2000 ,,,death for all were down 4 %,,about 4 thousand people,since thee introduction of PAIN MANAGEMENT,, Since the government thru fear,,propaganda,,media,,practicing medicine w/out a liscence,,ie 2001 thru 2016,,,24,000 more death ,,increasing by 2000 death each year,,,,now if that is not WILLFULL torture and genocide of the medically ill w/permanent physical pain due to a medical condition,,,,don’t know what is,,,MARYW

      6. Mary,
        I also believe that the doctors at all the VAMC’s are told what to do. Because they have such a cushy job, and they make a very good salary irregardless of what they do, they want to keep the cash cow job. Also they cannot be touched if they hurt and/or kill a veteran. The suit goes against the VA. The payment, if any, comes from the VA. Taxpayers pay for the VA doctors mistake. This means that if you pay taxes, you are paying yourself if you win a suit against the VA.
        I would not be surprised if the actual amount of deaths were higher. I am sure they are playing games with this as well to try and keep their experiment going. I am sure they are also making sure that this will not come back to the VA. it is such a shame that those of us who have jumped through all of their hoops to be able to have a life and to have a quality of life are now going to be considered “suicide risks” if we complain about how bad our lives will be without the pain medication. We will also be treated as “high risk drug addicts” if we continue to want the narcotic pain medications. It will not be that we “want” the meds, it is that they are the very thing that allows us the freedom to be able to leave our home, continue our employment, have a life, have a quality of life and to be above the survival mode.
        I have read the OSI and the recommendations and the goals according to the OSI are not what the Indy VAMC is doing. The Indy VAMC is set on taking away ALL narcotic in medications. They do not care if you get any type of relief or how you get it, as long as you are not getting the medications you desperately need from the Roudebush VAMC. smh

      7. Well glad to virtually meet you.

        I will never again speak to an attorney, media, anyone at the VA, nonone from the medical boards, politicians etc., unless it’s recorded. I had a damned recorder on me during the pain clinic orientation but turned it off too soon and not back on. It’s difficult to deal with long waits, in all kinds of pain/cramps, dealing with small chairs for normal people etc. Pain alone disrupts and interferes with daily functions, concentration, chores and the whole sheebang. Not fun. Plus dealing with everything else, while putting on a happy/tough face for others and being courteous to all while trying to dig for more information and stories. So I am not the good spy I was back in my union days dealing with all the liars and corruption.

        When they all start the ignoring game, having our “Secure Messaging” communication totally deleted, putting you on the defensive, then your a target. You bruised one of those sick psychopathic egos over there. That old silence game was like being married to the VA and some piece of crap female MD. I was told by a staff member at the CBOC I could not be treated the VA way or by what …I’ll use they, how they were trained and how to treat some patients. They, told me to ‘get the hell out of the VA because I was not going to like what’s coming.” To find a good geriatric MD. None to be found. Well I though that was over arguments over my communications and stuff missing from the online messaging. Oh, and pissing off some female computer tech over messing with my files the way she did. I learned you don’t piss off a “I am a professionally trained professional female at the VA and you have no right to question me.” So simple small things can bruise a sick ego and make waves all through the state. Plus they all seem to have the inability to compartmentalize their damn outside the VA activism and hate they may have for some of us. Plus to mention pissing others off in the community for daring to upset their diva trophy wives or something cause of all the connected cliques.

        My next visits the good people changed jobs or quit. Then I changed from the CBOC here to Indy and all the hell followed along and increased greatly. Along with all the activist crap. There was no way to discuss matters with the admin here either. They are ran by the lousy insurance group called Humana. They have a long record of not giving a damn about people. The constant revolving doors for proper MDs and good PCPs were total pathetic and ridiculous leading to a total break down in care and concern.

        Ortho, Pod, sleep, clinics were some I had the same issues with. They all pointed at each other and back at the Purple scum team. And some of the jokers they had at the front desk at Ortho was a uncaring, constant cafeteria running clowns.

        As I wrote before, a med tech that used to work there, being in total fear, told me that is how things are done there to run people off and make life miserable for some of us. No good reason needed but bruised egos or daring to question anyone there, or to complain when we have to pleasantly deal with staff burn-out and common tirades and fits of anger or nasty out-bursts from them. If one person wants you or anyone else gone, they are gone or treated badly. All the while our governor or anything to do with Indiana or VA care does the same things and puts on the Indiana Hamster’s exercise wheel of life run-around games, and totally ignoring us. I gave them all many chances to do their damned jobs or get concerned…never happened to this day.

        Sleep clinic totally lost my files at the time. As well as many of my tests over the years were not to be found.

        Going through my records I seen that the staff I thought were excellent, and told them so, also lied about my complaints and input. Even over special shoes I am to wear became not so wearable with the new contract they got from some cheaper shoe sales deal.

        All the waiting and game playing is… to wear us down, stress us out, confuse us. to go beyond any possible statutes of limitations, for witnesses and our memory slip away or die off, or for us to just shut-up and get tired of it all. I am going to bitch and moan till they put me in the easy bake oven. Then put me under my censored tombstone. Wow what power we the people have and oh such freedom so many died for and suffering done in vain.

        Spreading any kind of truth and negative information or stories around this state and college towns is impossible. There is just too much state and federal supported censoring going on and has for many years. But the sheep don’t care until something happens to them or too close to home. Then they are more than likely silence some how. Those in the cliques, mafias, corporate syndicates, politicians etc., can get it all. Like some vets are happy with all that FREE care until it kills them off unknowingly. Or the family too wrapped up in the fast lane or being trendy to pay attention to what kind of care we actually get.

        That is why I live in a corrupt town now with councils and shadow government that is akin to North Korea or fascist as Canada or whatever. Absolutely zero representation here for me, none. Very sad when town councils along with media and college, all the rest think that hounding and censoring, suppressing veterans is a good thing while laughing or bragging about it. Being good little petty tyrants and communist trash. And no-one dares stand up to them. It’s all a very real and vicious circle to be stuck in with no way out and it’s obvious over the -= years…that noone really cares. Most don’t care or seem much concerned about others or what’s happening in their own environment or health care. And really won’t take the time or have the knowledge to realize they are being treated poorly, that may lead them to death. Too busy with cell phones, games, entertainment, being trendy and whatever else it is some are glued to besides reality.
        I pray and wish you well F8
        Along with all others dealing with this crap.

        Mary, I haven’t met many MDs or staff either VA or modern civy care having the balls for truth and to stand up for patients. Not in this new American culture of ours. From what I have seen if I were an Illegal invader I could get and have it all….for free. Much better than what I have seen how vets are treated in Indiana or college towns. Too many folks in fear of the PC and fascist crowds and medical rulers for despair. People don’t really want to engage in common discussions anymore. Maybe just the weather if lucky.

        I gotta get off here. Then come back and check FB. I haven’t done much on there for years. If I get banned there like others I will go to “Seen” something whatever that is. Since Google and the rest are playing the censoring game too. Like Twitter. This country is in deep trouble along with some of us.

  37. As for the religious aspects of today’s article:

    I also was raised in a fiercely fundamental Christian (Methodists/Wesleyan), and will admit it was indeed oppressive and still have my impasses with my aging and ailing parents and we simply do not talk about those things, because at least in my family’s case, if their particular “flavor” of Christianity and “flavor” of Methodist denomination, if you took THAT example of Fanatical Fundamentalism, you indeed could make a case for a vague analogy, but perspective is everything, right?
    Extreme? Wait a minute (mind you, am not here slamming Christianity).
    My own parent’s church and congregation would GLADLY pay per view where all the homosexuals in the USA and World were taken to a remote island and nuked from orbit to be sure…and CLAP with GLEE afterwards while running to concession stand before asking forgiveness of showing any emotion. 🙂

    They also tend to lean on the embarrassingly racist side…heavy lean, and again, embarrassingly…not me.

    ISIS has been known to actually carry-out those things that I grew-up around right here in the good old Midwest.
    However, my parent’s “flavor” of Christianity condemn ISIS…but…(BIG BUT…), at the same time are CLAPPING while watching ISIS burn people in cages in news articles on TV because in their minds they see ISIS as bring-on the BIG WAR…Armageddon….concession stand, another forgiveness, more popcorn.

    What I am trying to convey in the ugliness of hypocrisy of many religions and their ultimate END GAME.

    I DO believe I acquired tid-bits of positive high notes from my own upbringing I am also embarrassed about because I come from a well respected hard working family and I do love my parents…but when my health started really going to crap, I found God again really damn quick…my “flavor” of God that is, because their “flavor” of God would rather me be part of a mushroom cloud carry-in dinner viewing party.

    See, perspective is everything. It’s not always pretty from any angle or was that angel? 🙂

    1. Benjamin-

      I was in no way opposing your stance in your FB interaction in today’s article, was just showing the “extreme cases” that those that like to generalize ALL into same “flavor or evil”…just as there’s many Muslims that condemn ISIS and absolutely hate that analogy to them.
      In that same way I care not to be associated with the “flavor” of Christianity my parents have created their dome of reality and protection from the real world from…but I DO realize my particular case is indeed an EXTREME ONE…but that’s how statistics are made…jump on those Puritans and so then the Atheists use this Puritanistic “flavor” of Christianity to try to bolster their confused state of mind and soul.

      These Ten Words have helped me all throughout my life:

      “If God be for us, who can be against us?” Romans 8:31. But be careful, I’ve heard the Devil is pretty good at quoting scripture as well. 🙂

  38. The VA kicked me off pain meds also. About 8 months ago. Rough time for a while. Now they are f_____g with the meds I was told to take for 1 year, after two surgeries. Still working on choice.

  39. I believe the bigger picture here is that the government knows that many will either commit suicide or go elsewhere for their meds. Either way that helps VA reduce cost. If you look at how they treated the Vietnam Vets about agent orange causing cancer. They didn’t admit that till 30+ years later and more than 70% of them were already dead. That is 70% that they don’t have to pay for.

    1. Amen,,the truth matter,,their willfully killing us,,by the means of torture,,which if any government employee was actually convicted of TORTURE,it,,CARRIES A LIFE SENTENCES,, appropriately,,as that is exactly what they sentence every man,women who honorable served our country and thru no fault of their own,,get injured,badly,,and ,”our ” government is sooo arrogant+ignorant they think they have the rite to forced these soldiers to suffer in physical pain from these MEDICAL injuries,protecting the freedom,,they are now taken from them..THE humane right to effective access to medical care as FREE ADULTS IN A ONCE FREE COUNTRY!!,When truth,,,is,,fact,,NO-ONE can ever physically feel the physical pain of another,,,IT IS LITERALLY impossible,,yet-they think they have the rite to decide who dies today in torturous physical pain,,and who does not die today,,thats called GENOCIDE!!!My brothers all served,,my father in law work, served and continue to work at the cia and dod for 30 years,,,Never spoke of his work,,but,,,always told us kids,,THE GOVERNMENT NEVER EVER TELLS THE PUBLIC THE TRUTH,,,EVER!!!!!!!mary

    2. Jay Check this out I presented to my new PC on our first & only appt & showed her 1 unopened & 1 half empty VA Prescription for Tylenol#3 that she prescribed to me & she told me I must be getting them from someplace else not the VA. It’s a no win situation. The unopened bottle was from having to prove to the previous PC I was not addicted & could pass the drug test which I did pass.

  40. This is how corrupt and STUPID are government is,,,Ask ANY vet if their physical pain from medical conditions are better w/less MEDICINE,,, they will tell u NO,,,IT SICKENS ME TO MY SOUL,,THAT THE GOVERNMENT BRAGGS ABOUT TORTURE AND GENOCIDE OF THE MEDICALLY ILL BY FORCIBLE TAKING AWAY medicine THAT HAS BEEN USED RESPONSIBLE BY 95% OF VETS,,,ALL A WHILE SUICIDE HAVE QUADRUPLED,,,did U KNOW,,,,WHEN pain management STARTED in the 1990 thru 2000 the suicide rate actually dropped by 5%,,,now it has increased by 70 %w/Dr./Government forcing our vets to suffer in physical pain,,from medical conditions,,and once a vet can no longer take the pain,,since that physical pain is with-in their own bodies,,now w/NO MEDICINE OR EFFECTIVE DOSAGE,,,THEY ARE FORCE TO CHOOSE A WAY TO LEAVE THAT BODY,,,,AS THEE ONLY WAY TO BE PHYSICALLY PAIN FREE,,IE,,”SELF TERMINATION,,” OF THAT BODY,,,, our government is willfully tortureing and using genocide to treat the medically ill as acost effective element and they brag about,,,wow,,and take the very freedom as ADULTS IN A FREE COUNTRY,, to have thee ability to choose our own axcess to effective medical care,,,and some government officials brags about it,,,THATS SICKINGING,,BARBARIC,,,AND ARCHAIC,,,This claim is pure propaganda,,that some idiots will believe!!!MARY proof= www,

  41. “[But for now, what do you think about the opioid reduction plan at VA. Was this an experiment guided by politics or real treatment conferring value and benefit for injured veterans?]”

    Considering the VA for most part did not even properly titrate Vets off these meds, and by the way, this also included Benzo’s that many of us with PTSD and Anxiety Disorders need to take for quality of life, while also having chronic pain…if both were involved, both the Opioid and Benzo was discontinued.

    I use private medical outside the VA with Medicare and when I was using the mental health hacks at the major university that had residents that were working both at the VA and at my medical center, they did the exact same thing, and with fierce vengeance around January of 2016 is when I finally had enough and decided to go homeopathic as much as I can because I no longer trust *any* mental health hack…in my case, they were telling me that even though I had absolutely no history of abuse, no asking for increased dosage from 1996 to 2016, that JUST BECAUSE I was on low dose pain meds and Benzo’s my health was somehow suddenly at RISK?
    This whole loaf of baloney was the VA trying to do damage control from what the VA’s own CANDY MAN AT TOMAH implemented at ALL VA’s…drug cocktails of the experimental type…but once the spotlight of daylight was continually shown on Tomah and a very resistant CANDY MAN, the knee-jerk reaction of the petulant child called the VA was…NO VETERAN shall have relief.
    Getting myself off 3 Mg Extended Release Xanax and up to 2 Mg. immediate release Xanax per day took a good part of last year but since January of this year, no more. I also removed myself formally from Mental Health Care and using from Valerian Root to Melatonin to assist in sleep and anxiety…it’s not perfect…but I also use other homeopathic means to help in those vacated RX areas of life.
    Nowhere does the VA let-on that in their Opioid Safety Initiative (OSI) that the method the VA utilized mostly it seems is those Vets that got such meds automatically mailed to them suddenly ceased, without any forewarning whatsoever…how the f^ck is THAT scientific methods?

    In the real world that would be called a Class Action Lawsuit of Malpractice.

    I often wonder if the Tomah Candy Man had been prescribing tapioca enemas laced with opioids if they VA would have gone to every Vet’s home and removed all packets of tapioca and any enema equipment or just leave all that and take the opioids for their own use on the way to the next vet’s home?

    Remember, the VA has a serious drug problem….they are stealing drugs from the Pharmacy according to a few reports over last few weeks. Kind of makes you wonder if the VA pulled all this crap on Vets but NEVER ADDRESSED their own employee’s drug problem? One huge smokescreen to cover-up the VA’s own problem with substance abuse, that’s my theory anyway.

    1. I also wonder if the many Vets that had VA Mailed RX’s **missing** or suddenly cut-off, were being funneled BACK to some addicted hacks at the VA? I think there’s so much more to this scandal and the very fierce fight the Candy Man made, and reports of drug abuse at the VA’s systemically? Blame the Vets seems the SOP.

    2. Namnibor, they also cut Cyclobenzaprine a muscle relaxer AND the sleeping pill Temazpam which was extremely hard to overcome. I’ve seen people come off Xanax, its rough. I’m allergic to Melatonin & just about everything sold over the counter.

  42. Comments are closed?? How in the hell did I miss that, after I had typed up a long post in reply to the article.

    1. Nav,
      Ben’s having trouble with something. Don’t worry your comment will post.

    1. Lem, you beat me to that question.

      Out of 679,000 to 471,000! That leaves 208,000 without proper pain management healthcare. The Veterans are now having to deal, on a daily basis, with pain.

      I’ll ask it again, Lem. “How many [MORE] suicides resulted from the lack of pain management?”
      If you notice, I’ve added one more word to Lem’s question.

      I believe the “20 suicides/day” is another “SPIN” by VA! For some reason I believe it’s more likely than not—- MORE! And it could be a lot MORE!

      Plus, when was the last time y’all have ever heard the truth be uttered by anyone at any VA facility?
      “SPINNING” diatribe, or outright LYING, by VA is standard operating procedures for these asswipes!

      1. Or go back before 2001 and ask how many fewer suicides there were? And ask the question, is it better to be addicted or dead?

        I’m possibly partly responsible for the addiction problem for letters to the Secretary asking the above questions. Especially after there was a little jump in the suicide rate.
        Problem is improper monitoring. When a guy is in distress put him in the hospital and control the opiate level like they do in Japan. These aren’t high cost patients. All they need is a bed, a nurse to ask how their pain is every 4 to 6 hours. They can ambulate and do self care otherwise.

    2. @Lem- My VA facility offers no Proper Pain Management Program. They are so incompetent, that a Nurse Practitioner prescribes my pain medications instead of the Physician in the Pain Management Department. The Nurse Practitioner isn’t a Pain Specialist either. Poor pain management modalities, without proper goal setting, and teamwork between patient and their Primary Care Provider. Frigging stupid, at the least. Yeah VA, your Evidence Based Criteria is making Veterans to needlessly suffer more. Kiss off you unwiped assholes.

    3. This is in response to Lem:

      Lem March 23, 2017 at 12:13 pm
      Question is, how many suicides resulted from the lack of pain management.

      Now THAT is a good damn question which we all know full well VA will NEVER EVER admit to,if they even knew in the first place ya know? By entirely pulling Vets off ALL of their pain meds without proper methods, Vets are at GREAT GREAT Risk by doing this!! I personally know 2 who couldn’t take it anymore with their unreal pain status and ended up leaving notes saying, “Now the Pain is finally gone” — Also, not to be a hypocrite whatsoever, I even fight these demons myself everyday when I don’t have enough left to get me to my next refill. Thank God there are a few reasons in my life which prevent me from doing this too!

      Contact me if you are within the Capitol Region area and wish to obtain the name and contact info for this outstanding Doctor who not only cares for all his patients, but as a Retired Naval Commander identifies with us too (Hell, he even has his own VA Rating himself!) Someone PLEASE tell me how we can start petitions, or get the point across by putting pressure on VA to rethink, restart, and save the lives of our Vets that are TRULY & HONESTLY suffering from extreme pain every single day? What can we do folks?


      1. The Petition Site? Agree it’s out of hand, and the war on Pain Patients isn’t just some more VA bull-crap, I personally know of 3 total horror stories of people being inappropriately “weaned” or flat out being denied proper treatment for pain “on the legal economy” To include someone with TERMINAL METASTASIZED BREST CANCER who is being limited to LESS pain control than I am by the VA ATM…

      2. Lawyerlynn has the solution. Never heard of a pot head committing suicide. Some studies claim excessive use leads to depression. But compared to any of the other pain medications?

      3. “Lawyerlynn has the solution. Never heard of a pot head committing suicide. Some studies claim excessive use leads to depression. But compared to any of the other pain medications?”

        It’s not my solution, I’m just the messenger here. Likely that I’m not smart enough to think these things up, but they taught me how to read on my plantation & it’s one thing I can still do.

        As for “studies” you mention … beware of the trap. Most studies are done by institutions that have major conflict of interest in reporting the truth. Such as, those studies done by the same people (or whatever they are) who run the jails, bureaucracies, probation, social workers, cps, doctors, med/pharm, etc. They all have m$ch to gain, mucho shekels by keeping this away with flawed studies.

        I doubt anyone here would believe that studies are flawed in the interest of …. ummmm …. well, let’s just say that no matter, the point is that because you cannot overdose or die or have harmful effects from taking too much, you could, in theory, cut out alot of the B.S. involved with health care or healing or whatever.

        I’m just totally flabbergasted that the states where medical is legal, they still DENY vets with PTSD to use it. I’ll just have to leave that one to the smart folks. I’m going back to tend to my earthworm farm project before it gets dark. Arbeit macht frei. Bless.

    4. Damn sight more than the alleged number of OD’s the DEA is making up as occurring. HINT: If the opiate in question that caused the OD was HEROIN, it was NOT “In-appropriate use of a prescription pain killer” DEA hosted itself on it’s own petards with THAT ONE since they insist that HEROIN HAS NO MEDICAL VALUE and as such IS NOT LEGALLY AVAILABLE, so counting the HEROIN OD’s as unfortunity and un-necessary they are, as an OD or other adverse outcome of LEGAL NARCOTIC PAIN MANAGEMENT is something I wait 6 months before I fertilize my fields with… I suspect as the war against ALL chronic pain VICTIMS ramps up as it is doing we will be suicide at an even more alarming rate than the 20 a day they are so proudly DOWN TO from 22 a day… Reported and identified as Combat Vets of course, so some will be being missed, and not just the ones deliberately being missed…

  43. I will show you meds i was on for over decade with spine problems and fragment in L-4-5 .480mgs opiates you will shit when you see all the meds.i think i died when they pulled this opiate reduction bullshit.its been 2 1/2 years i dont sleep iam forever in pain. For awhile i was killing pain with alot of alcohol. If there is a Hell i hope these holier than thou pieces of trash find it and forever burn so they’ll then understand the pain.some of us had

  44. My husband stopped taking the pain pills in 2014, on his own because he was tired of be treated like a drug addict because he was taking a medication they gave him. He went through the SHARE program and they put him on a Butrans patch for pain. It worked good enough and he was happy on it. We went back to the VA and they told us if he wanted the patch he would need to go through the drug and alcohol addiction program. Instead they put him right back on the hydocodone we had gotten him off of. He said enough is enough and we started using all natural remedies like essential oils. Some veterans don’t have the support they need and will turn to drugs outside the VA. This isn’t helping anyone!!! My husband lives with his pain. He is reminded all day every day what the VA does to them. It is way more work on me helping him on the natural substances, as his caregiver, but without the care from the VA caregiver program since we were illegally kicked out of that in 2015. Guess him not taking their pills made the caregiver program decide he was fixed. He is not but he is tired of living his life by the obnoxious demands of the VA. They need to stop making up the rules as they go along and actually have a system that is working to help veterans and their families thrive!

  45. I can tell you that I wish the Trump Administration would look into this. It is against the law to withhold medications from a person because they don’t submit to some test – specifically urine or blood test. It is also against the law (4th Amendment) for illegally obtaining blood or urine samples before giving medications and telling the patient about their 4th amendment rights. See the following SCOTUS ruling:

    On March 21, the U.S. Supreme Court declared that a South Carolina public hospital’s policy of testing pregnant patients for illicit substances without their consent violates the Fourth Amendment’s protections against unreasonable searches. Ruling 6-3 in Ferguson v. Charleston, the Court held that because the drug tests were taken for the purpose of incriminating the patients, the Charleston Medical University of South Carolina hospital had a special obligation to ensure that the patients were fully informed of their Fourth Amendment rights.

    What the VA does is have you sign some paper under duress and coercion, which is also against the law, saying if you don’t sign it we don’t give you the medication.

    And if the government does not want to do it, then I really hope that a team of attorneys are willing to take up the cause, which I would help with cost, to fight the government. Keeping medications from people that are truly in pain, is inhumane to say the least, and criminal to say the most. If they spent these resources on actual solutions like fixing people’s aliments, then we would have less people on pain medication, they would enjoy their life, and be productive. And most of all the VA would not have to see so many patients each year.

  46. I’m prescribed Opioids by the VA, for cronic pain, without which, I would have no quality of life. This fact is not arguable. My usage doesn’t increase. Nor, as there any euphoric affects. They just make it so I can function…end of story.
    But I can just see the VA, in the interest of statistics, discontinuing these medications.
    Then I become your neighbor, otherwise a responsible veteran-citizen, buying dope from a dealer. Or just contribute to the sad statistics, like those denied timely and proper care.
    Screw them and their “statistics”.

    1. Amen Thomas please read my comment below,,and use a dot instead of comma after www. Please sign,,repeal cdc guideline,maryrw

      1. maryw,
        There’s no way I, or anyone else that I know of, who would sign anything having to do with moveon dot org.
        If you’re unaware, that group is backed by and paid to by George Soros.
        If you don’t know about this NAZI COLLABORATOR, look him up!
        There’s a great “60 minutes” Video on him. Where he admits to “turning in Jewish people, to the NAZIS during WWII, while he was a teenager. The surprising thing you’ll learn is, he himself IS JEWISH!
        There’s more, but for now, that’s all I have to say about this TRAITOROUS person!

      2. i do not know that crazy elf,,,,,,,,but i was more concerned about the subject matter,,,but thank u for letting me know,,,mary

    2. DITTO 110% My Friend Thomas!!

      I am a 90% Service Connected Marine Corps Vet with NUMEROUS injuries sustained from a massive IED Blast while in Iraq during OIF II. At first VA treated me very good by obtaining the appropriate tests, Specialized Dr;s and then thankfully ratings which truly did not take that long to go thru! (Yes I know, I am one of the lucky ones who somehow got thru this maze of madness system and was rated correctly!) I feel horrible for those out there waiting months and years due to them “Losing files, improperly rated, and so man other BS excuses which often times end up with Vets DYING while awaiting their rating & Care!) BS!!

      Like you Thomas, I too live with BRUTAL Chronic Pain due to severe damage in my Cervical Spine which I was prescribed numerous Opiod Pain Meds just so I could get out of bed in the am and function during the days! Do you remember when they went forward with their stupid ass Policy of revoking ALL Opiod Meds from ALL of us who were greatly in need for them? I have never been so incensed about an Agency pulling the blanket right out from under us – AND I will add risking thousands of Veterans lives by immediately stopping their meds without titrating them down correctly, or issuing them Suboxone the proper way so that our bodies don’t go into withdrawal (Which is absolutely the worst experience Ive ever been thru too!)

      Typical Military BS by punishing EVERYONE else for the errors of a few. Sure there are many who may abuse their Pain Meds, sell them to make ends meet, or require themselves to take more than what is prescribed due to having taken them for decades and that they now don’t even work for us due to tolerance! We NEVER EVER use the word “Addiction” in our cases! Don’t these buffoons understand the issue of “Physical Dependency” and what it does to the body when these Opiate Meds are instantly stopped being prescribed? UTTER Chaos, worse pain, and that spins the emotional status out of control then too, which as stated here- leads to many taking their pain needs to the street or other ways just to remain able to function!

      And then they make their “wonderful” announcements that Opiate use it is down by large proportions making the public think they have been helping us “Detox” of stop taking these meds! Once again, these complete idiots have no idea what they are doing to us out here in extreme levels of pain without ANYTHING to take but Over the Counter crap – which ever ends up working at all – am I right here guys?
      Fortunately for myself, I obtained the “OUTSIDE” external services of a miracle Pain Management Dr here in the DC Area who TRULY cares for his patients and after detailed reviews of ones issues, prescribes the minimum levels of Opitate Meds to help us get thru one Efing day at a time! (BTW- Anyone here in the MD, VA & DC area is welcome to contact me for the name and info of this awesome physician! Matter of fact, HE was the MAIN MAN who instituted the Wounded Warrior Care Program himself and after seeing how they wanted to mold him into their own little piece of clay – he Dropped His papers and Retired as a Navy Commander and started his own practice where you truly feel special and taken care of with methods which VA doesnt even have or use yet! Its absolutely surreal they cant do this stuff such as a “Coolief” Radio Frequency Ablation, Stellate Ganglion Blocks, High & Low Dose Ketamine treatments for pain and medication control for you. I would be proud to help anyone in the area obtain a level of care si superior than VA you don’t feel jerked around or stuck in the system lost! I realize that some may not be able to afford his treatments – but he does take EVERY type of Insurance you can imagine as well! Worth a try?

      I don’t know how to assist any of you seeking answers to your pain treatment by having you reach out to me. Guess I would need to know how many here would even be interested in the first place? Feel free to reply to my long ass msg here (Sorry, its a symptom of my PTSD) but I wanted to try and cover everything relevant to this major issue. Never once did I take too many of my own meds and end up like The Walking Dead, but unfortunately some out there get stuck in that vicious circle and I feel for you guys big time!
      It sucks Ihad to go outside VA to obtain proper care on Service Connected stuff, but regardless, its something I truly needed to get thru each day. Hope this helps and again – please find a way to let me know who, how many, etc are interested in obtaining the absolute BEST CARE AVAILABLE in this region without getting jerked around and perhaps losing your life in the meantime! Stay safe and hardcore guys!

      Semper Fidelis,


      1. Hey Gunny
        I am amazed at the va bs we put up with.
        Now addiction is all iþ said to be. Back in
        The 80’& 90″s it was.morphine and metadone
        In addition to a varities of pills
        So now we deal with hmmm? Answer.
        Need programs in the communities of America

      2. Gunny,,,if u know of any,,or anyone knows of anyone who had to choose ,”self termination,” to stop their physical pain from medical injury/illness,,,[email protected] want to honor our dead ie,Pain Patient Memorial april 23 and 30th,,,or got to Pharmacist Steve site and simple type in Pain Patient memorial schedule,,,,maryw

      3. Gunny
        I would like to contact you but you didn’t leave an email address. Please respond with your contact info.
        100% SC Navy DAV

      4. Gunny,

        Is the doctors name Aubrey Verdun? I am in the process of trying to see him at the WWPACI at Walter Reed.

        John Hill

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